Hey y’all, In the past I had arranged that /f/piracy in raddle.me would be the fallback forum for /r/piracy, but I recently noticed that raddle.me has disabled new user registrations and that would be a problem in case we need it.

And with reddit about to go public, it might be needed.

Instead of trying to spin up my own lemmy instance, I was thinking if I could get a mod position in this forum and specify it as the official /r/piracy fallback instead.

Feel free to PM me in reddit for verification.

Dessalines
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321Y

To echo some of the thoughts of those below:

This was one of the first communities I made here on lemmy, because I was disappointed in /r/piracy for two reasons:

  • Removals of piracy links, content, guides, etc.

I realize most of that is unavoidable self-policing, because reddit is a US-based company that must adhere to the US’s draconian copyright and IP laws. Lemmy is self-hostable, and doesn’t have that problem. Outside of illegal or harmful content, there’s no reason for us to remove anything piracy-related. So a lot of those bans and removals are probably not the mod’s fault, its work reddit requires you to do to have a presence there.

  • A “soft” / “pickme” approach to piracy.

A lot of people on /r/piracy either support or half-support centralized services like netflix and spotify. Copy-leftists like myself believe these services are really harmful to keeping data alive and shared. People that either never torrented in the first place, or that have moved off torrenting, make one less seeder, or adder of new content. I can’t even find some newer documentaries and music on torrents, because netflix and spotify have successfully captured and privatized that data, and new people no longer have a pro-sharing mentality: Netflix lets them have an “I got mine” mentality.

So counter to /r/piracy, !piracy@lemmy.ml has a strict anti-centralized services rule.

At the same time, I welcome genuine pro-piracy mods from reddit who would like to get started over here, and do a better job building and growing this community more than I ever could. If you sticky a post or put something in the sidebar of /r/piracy having this as a backup, I’ll mod you. Or you could just make another piracy community here, something like /c/piracynews and have control over that community.

cc @Farmer_Heck@lemmygrad.ml

Divided by Zer0
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Unfortunately, point A is unavoidable. We already got contacted by the reddit admins with an almost impossible demand (police not only new stuff, but also historical stuff) so we had to take a very draconian approach to avoid takedown.

While I agree with point B myself, being a staunch proponent of copylefts, it doesn’t make sense to censor people for not being as radical as we area. It’s by rubbing noses with us that they will change their tune.

To be clear, I am generally not against being more explicit anti-centralized, but while growing /r/piracy, it didn’t make sense.

At the same time, I welcome genuine pro-piracy mods from reddit who would like to get started over here, and do a better job building and growing this community more than I ever could. If you sticky a post or put something in the sidebar of /r/piracy having this as a backup, I’ll mod you.

Done. Check the the sidebar in https://old.reddit.com/r/Piracy/

The main objective here is to be able to redirect people over and make sure we don’t splinter the community if and when reddit takes action against /r/piracy.

Ninmi
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151Y

Lemmy is the place you’d want to move people to in case of a greater calamity as federated Lemmy is by nature more community controlled than Reddit or any centralized alternative could literally ever be.

Divided by Zer0
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101Y

There’s other alternatives, like Aether or my own lemmy instance. But I tend to try the path of least resistance first.

Aether is fine but development is pretty dead compared to lemmy and it’s fucking Electron.

Divided by Zer0
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31Y

Yeah I’m not too keen on it either tbh. I prefer lemmy as well. I tried in the past with scuttlebutt as well but it didn’t stick.

yeah lemmy is much better than Aether right now

Also I’m not completely sure their democratic/reputation system actually works in practice, since it has never been enabled.

Dessalines
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131Y

Cool, I got you modded now.

BTW if anyone else would like to be modded and help grow this community, lmk.

Divided by Zer0
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81Y

Cheers! I’ll make a sticky in /r/piracy soon to make people update their bookmarks and maybe we can have some early adopters here as well

@uthredii
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61Y

This is great news =).

I find the megathread on reddit really useful, are you involved in making it? Would it be possible for it to be posted/pinned here whenever it is updated?

krolden
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01Y

At this point you should let Reddit ban /r/piracy. Less page views for them the better.

@Whom
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81Y

Losing /r/piracy would be a real shame. I haven’t had a reddit account in years, but I still visit occasionally because the megathread and other things are such great resources (especially when I need to grab stream links for friends too scared to torrent). It’s important for outreach, whether we like it or not.

@xvf
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Why do you feel the need to be mod?🤔

You can just be a user just like everyone else.

Divided by Zer0
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81Y

If I am going to redirect all the sizable community of reddit /r/piracy to a safe haven, I feel I have a responsibility to make sure that the destination is well run. The only way I can do that is to be a mod.

I think you need to prove you can be a mod here like you’ve done on reddit. Not against it since you’ve proven you’re able to run that subreddit, but I would argue if you want to moderate this community you should start getting links posted here along with encouraging those on reddit to come here ad well to grow this community.

I think you have experience, but the moderator status should be earned from contributions to this site and growth of this community, not from another site.

@dogmuffins
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91Y

That being the case, wouldn’t it make more sense to just start your own instance? That’s the only way you could ensure the destination is… “well run”.

Ninmi
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51Y

I feel you should just redirect people here anyway before it’s too late. I’m sure the mods here might need help anyway in case of a big influx of users.

@DPUGT2
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41Y

Supposing that somehow “well run” means anything that anyone else agrees with, aren’t you sort of the poster child of “not well run”? During your tenure at reddit, for instance, r/piracy became almost entirely useless. Years of prime advice was nuked when you erased everything but the last 6 months of history. Rules, and also secret rules, were enacted that make it impossible to discuss anything important. Contributors were banned form the subreddit having already demonstrated their worth.

As it is now, if the MPAA and RIAA teamed up with the Spanish priests who burned the Mayan codices to run a piracy internet forum, they still wouldn’t do as shitty a job as r/piracy does. If you had any sort of integrity at all, wouldn’t you have shut down the forum years ago?

Divided by Zer0
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111Y

Years of prime advice was nuked when you erased everything but the last 6 months of history.

You realize the alternative was to lose the subreddit to the reddit admins, yes?

@DPUGT2
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-71Y

So you destroyed the village in order to save it? You did lose the subreddit anyway. Nothing could ever be discussed. Everyone self-censored even if you didn’t force the issue on them.

The admins did it. But instead of them doing it despite your efforts, you cooperated. Hell, even that might be forgivable if afterward you’d realized the mistake you made and owned up to it. Instead, you’re here defending it.

What great lessons have you learned, that the same or similar wouldn’t be repeated here? I mean, another person might have spent years struggling with and straining their brain to figure out how to make a forum that assholes like the reddit admins can’t nuke. No, your best is apparently waiting for someone else to come up with a possible solution, and then just migrating over to it until the copyright trolls catch up and start lobbing legal thermonukes in this direction. Then I guess you’ll cooperate again, and wait for yet another forum to be created somewhere else, only to repeat the pattern.

Hello, I read the situation, and they made the right call from what it looks like. Shutting down the entire subreddit would have been worse than its mostly intact existence now, and the old posts were archived, so the post link removal is not an issue. Old content and talk was never lost. The talk of an exodus being possible in the first place here, is because it was not shut down back then.

@DPUGT2
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-21Y

Shutting down the entire subreddit would have been worse

How? If shut down, then there would be no forum. And the other option, there was the appearance of a forum, where nothing of substance about the topic it was founded upon could be discussed.

This wasn’t about people posting torrent links (or not just that). They were nuking all sorts of shit. Discussions of when torrents might become available in the future, technical details on how anything worked, release names. You name it, anything of interest was gone (and that’s only from that point going forward, literally everything going backwards was scrubbed and scrubbed hard).

When a large social media platform continues to exist, even if it’s bad, even if it’s unusable… it sucks the oxygen out of the room. Often making it impossible for anything else to take its place, even if that substitute would fix those problems. By keeping that forum around, it starved out other possible venues for years.

It wasn’t the right call. It just happened to be the only call where he got to continue to “be in charge”. Which is the thing he’s most concerned about here, with this post.

and the old posts were archived, so the post link removal is not an issue.

That’s great for historiants in the 26th century, they have access to all of those posts. For the vast majority of human beings alive today, they are effectively gone. They cannot be found without extraordinary, heroic efforts. Which no one will bother to do, because if they knew what it was they were looking for exactly, there’d be no reason to search in the first place.

“Don’t worry that he burned down the public library, some millionaire book collector who lives in Europe somewhere has private copies of all the rare editions!”

The talk of an exodus being possible in the first place here, is because it was not shut down back then.

That exodus happened way back then. Just no one noticed because they had a heavily-censored forum with enough activity that it looked like something was going on.

I have not even used r/piracy ever, because I have been on top of almost everything for longer than a decade. But people visited there, and got advice, so it is a place where people can get help.

The scrubbed data is here, not hard to find, all in a 91 MB 7z archive. https://old.reddit.com/r/piracy/b3zzzp/

@DPUGT2
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-41Y

The scrubbed data is here, not hard to find, all in a 91 MB 7z archive. https://old.reddit.com/r/piracy/b3zzzp/

Sure. And I can go read cuneiform tablets to find out what the ancient Babylonians had to say.

@TheAnonymouseJoker
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You realise right that you can download and get to reading all of that 91 MB of text within 5 minutes on your computer? You said:

For the vast majority of human beings alive today, they are effectively gone. They cannot be found without extraordinary, heroic efforts.

This is simply untrue.

@DPUGT2
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-31Y

This is simply untrue.

It’s simply true. Perhaps you think you can do it, which means that everyone else can do it and easily. You are atypical.

For everyone else, this is effectively gone. Even for the people who’d hang out in r/piracy who can be counted on to be slightly more technically savvy, it’s effectively gone. I know how to download your link (I even know how to find it without your help). I know what a 7z link is. I know or can find out what format those posts are in (json?). But I’ll be damned if I can search through them to find anything useful or interesting, and I know even less than that about how to index them to make them easily searchable by anyone else.

They’re dead. Dead and buried. In giant concrete containment vaults like some scragged nuclear reactor.

Aggressively asserting that I’m wrong isn’t the same thing as making an intelligent argument.

@TheAnonymouseJoker
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Wait what? Are you claiming that opening HTML page for each archived post is impossible for anyone?u

I know what a 7z link is. I know or can find out what format those posts are in (json?)

This proves you did not even bother to download and check the file structure layout, and are making assumptions upon assumptions. Why comment without checking?

They’re dead. Dead and buried. In giant concrete containment vaults like some scragged nuclear reactor.

Over reaction. A very bad take.

You are doubling down unnecessarily and dying on the wrong hill, mate. Stop.

@DPUGT2
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-21Y

You are doubling down unnecessarily and dying on the wrong hill, mate. Stop.

No.

I’m not “dying on a hill”. How will I be punished exactly?

@TheAnonymouseJoker
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Downvotes from Lemmurs (not redditors) and disagreement? It also takes away some of your credibility in discussions here. Admitting the wrongs and acceptance goes a long way in life.

Nobody is sending a bunch of prostitutes to your home, do not worry.

krolden
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31Y

Fuck everybody else then. If they’re too lazy to spend 5 minutes reading then they shouldn’t be able to figure out how to download a movie.

Stop catering to the laziest users. If you want something go find it yourself.

@DPUGT2
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-11Y

If they’re too lazy to spend 5 minutes reading

“If they’re too lazy to spend 10 years digging through and understanding technology so that they can find, download, and parse a strange archive of a no-longer-existing forum, then spend months reading through that to find the hidden gems, then they’re just not worthy of my hobby and fuck them!”

THIS. This is exactly the attitude I want for mods in a piracy forum. And for the defenders of those moderator candidates.

The positive, uplifting attitude, the graciousness, the politeness. Just all of it. Why wouldn’t he (and you!) be a great mod?

Stop catering to the laziest users.

You’ve never stopped to think about this a day in your life, have you?

Piracy is a numbers thing. If there are 5 of us, no matter how good we are at it, this dies. It just does. If there are 50 million of us, they can’t ever hope to stomp us out. So yeh, if the laziest users are willing to lazily “use” once in awhile, that helps me even if it can be irritating.

I knew of a piracy “scene” that is deader than coffin nails… userbase too small. Started infighting, the elites wanted to get rid of the lazy users, became even smaller. Now dead. No IRC, no forums, no nothing. When you try to do research on it, you find 16 year old posts to forum pages that sometimes you get to read the Google cache for, or maybe Wayback has a copy. Should be the opposite, the tools available today, should be easier than ever. But just gone.

That’s what you and people like you would turn it all into if you had your way.

krolden
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41Y

Your analogies are bad and you should feel bad

@DPUGT2
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-21Y

Why would I ever give you the power over me to make me feel bad?

What kind of asshole are you that you’d want that power over anyone?

@uthredii
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31Y

Because if they are directing the existing r/piracy to here as a backup they should maintain control.

@snek_boi
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131Y

Lemmy being a fallback for a massive Reddit community sounds amazing! I guess it sorta makes me hope the fact it’s piracy doesn’t become an existential issue for Lemmy. But, in general, this kind of transitioning is amazing!

Bigly support, /r/piracy is run well - Would be great to see this here too

Divided by Zer0
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61Y

Thanks. We try :)

@lfod14
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-11Y

Run well? You ever been there?

@DPUGT2
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-11Y

I agree. If he were in my neighborhood, I’d definitely want to elect him as president of the HOA too! That would never backfire. Anyone who wants to be a mod is the exact sort of person who should be a mod. It shouldn’t come down to technical ability, or to philosophical predisposition, or anything else like that. Instead, we need to seek out those people who yearn to be busybodies. Oh, wait, I guess we don’t even have to do that, they’ll rush to us instead, nagging to put chains around our neck and sell our homes out from under us at auction if we don’t keep the lawn shorter than 4.75" tall!

Black Tulip
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81Y

@dessalines@lemmy.ml just tagging to make sure you see this request.

@lfod14
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71Y

Hopefully you don’t ban people on your own thing for asking for something to be Pirated based on political beliefs.

@dogmuffins
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71Y

This is such a weird request.

It’s inevitable that lemmy will be a refuge for redditors at some point (although I don’t necessarily think that the IPO will cause an exodus), but that doesn’t mean that lemmy needs to mirror reddit.

Therefore IMO mod status on reddit is nothing more than “relevant experience”, with the caveat that it comes with an obvious agenda.

I guess the real actual question is whether lemmy.ml/f/piracy should be promoted by reddit.com/r/piracy as the sanctioned alternative. Which again is a weird request. The present mods responsibility is to serve the interests of the present subscribers. Im making some assumptions here but if present subscribers wanted this to be just like reddit, they would just be on reddit rather than here.

Suffice to say, if it were up to me I would politely decline this request.

@DPUGT2
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71Y

but that doesn’t mean that lemmy needs to mirror reddit.

Given the trajectory of reddit over the years, it might be true that you’d all be better off if you took action to prevent it from being too similar.

I guess the real actual question is whether lemmy.ml/f/piracy should be promoted by reddit.com/r/piracy as the sanctioned alternative.

A more important question, I think, perhaps the only one even, is whether Lemmy is any less vulnerable to the sorts of legal attacks that make r/piracy so problematic. I suspect I know the answer to this question, and that many of the rest of you do as well… it just happens to be one that none of us like.

@uthredii
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The present mods responsibility is to serve the interests of the present subscribers.

I disagree, mods in general are dooing free labour for the benefit of the community.

The mod of r/piracy (one of the best resources for pirated content I have found) thinks having a backup on Lemmy would help the community. So maybe we should support this instead of saying it’s not their responsibility lol

@dogmuffins
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51Y

That’s my point though. “The community” in this case is not reddit users, but lemmy users. As I said, it’s really a question of whether existing users in this sub want it to be a mirror of reddit’s sub.

@greensand
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Afaik there isn’t much to moderate here anyway, so there should be enough mods already

@pancake
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71Y

I personally see it fine, it’s not like Lemmy is a shelter away from tyrannical mods or anything… But I’m not sure how necessary that really is; maybe the team here will be happy if you lend a hand? I know some communities are having it hard to get enough moderation, but that might not be the case here.

@TheAnonymouseJoker
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This mod is a person with legit pro-piracy interests, and has anarchist leaning required for the same.

Edit: I am feeling a bit conflicted now

Look fella, everyone’s got to give a little bit here, right? Right. What about you get us a mass exodus of people from Reddit and we get you a nice little shiny mod on /c/piracy? Waddayasay, boyo?

It seems people don’t know what a joke is.

krolden
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31Y

Squid pro qoa

Helix 🧬
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31Y

Insert trade offer meme here

Reddit has turned you into a power hungry hippo, its best that you unlearn or cleanse yourself off of the mod toxicity first.

@hello_lebbit
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1Y

deleted by creator

CHEF-KOCH
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Bans me and other valid members for no reason, had no guts to sort this out via DM and decided to ignore me + others… now comes years later into Lemmy and begs to do the same here or what… are you serious…

Dude you guys, ALL of you piracy mods on Reddit s+ck a+s, you do miserable job, do not give any f+++s about piracy nor the community itself. The only thing you guys care is to take control, nothing more.

Most people are here because you banned them or shadow blocked them. Get the F out here man.

@pinknoise
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Bans me and other valid members for no reason, had no guts to sort this out via DM and decided to ignore me + others…

Something you would never do lol

krolden
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41Y

Lmao

CHEF-KOCH
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Correct, I do not ban valid post, I ban trolls such as him who argue without anything.

PS

I also never pretended to be a good Mod, but I at least listen to actual reasons if someone tries to contact me via DM because you need to understand both sides to justify a guild ban.

krolden
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61Y

Dude you deleted everyone’s comments that disagreed with you. You are a bad mod

Are you sure there are many such other people? We would need more than 1-2 anon testimonies to atleast know if this is a trend. OP mod and community have been pretty cooperative with The Eye, and that looks to me like a decent sign.

CHEF-KOCH
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21Y

Reddit’s piracy Subreddit is known to ban everyone who - according to mods - causes slight troubles, the internet is full of it. I can get 50 people in here, that contacted me on Reddit, they also got banned for no reason or no good reason at all, and the Mods never respond to mod mails.

Last I checked, The Eye is dead because of lack of funding.

Sounds really weird if true, people should post modmail as collective proof. What is there to stop anyone, since Lemmy has independent people?

CHEF-KOCH
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1Y

Not if, it is true.

He does not belong into piracy at all nor on Lemmy. Same like any of the other faceless Piracy clowns. No backbone, now they trying to influence and take control over this sub because they know that their own sub is going down due to Reddit changes.

@TheAnonymouseJoker
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That sowed some doubt in my mind. I will have to look around even more, it seems. They should earn their status by showing their worth here, now that I think.

Edit: those testimonies seem really bad examples to me, there are like 700K members on reddit, and 2 botched up bans for weird reasons seems a bit… weird.

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