The reason young men went hard-right in the last decade is because left-wing movements stopped talking about issues that affect men. The vacuum was filled by people like Jordan Peterson.

You can’t build a popular movement and be dismissive of half of the population.

Like men’s lib, but Marxist? I think that would be neat. It’s definitely necessary. The way men are socialized + all the incel/fascist pipelines is creating so much misery. And literally killing people. We should try to combat that as much as we can.

As a woman I really wish we would put more focus on the patriarchy. I think many communists, particularly male communists, tend to underestimate the importance of it. Maybe because whenever the patriarchy is discussed, it is usually to point out the misogyny. I wish empathy for women could be enough, but if men are taught from birth that we are their servants and accessories then their empathy has already been dampened. So it’s not enough to talk about women’s issues. We also need to talk about men’s issues in a way that keeps all this in mind.

Men’s rights movements tend to devolve into incel hellholes, but so long as a feminist lens and Marxist perspective is being utilized then there’s at least a chance that it won’t.

I hope there can be a movement of men supporting men in a non-toxic way. I really think you could accomplish so much if you made a movement based on radical compassion for each other. Men supporting men, in the ways that men need to be supported. Open up to each other, display your vulnerabilities, be soft. That would be brave.

Talk to any male marxist and they will tell you that the way they experience oppression under capitalism is different than the way women do. Of course, there are differences between experienced oppression of say, for example, different minorities, but some of the common/shared ways that men experience oppression include things like mental health outcomes and incredible social isolation. These are factors that are contributory to the fascist pipeline.

So obviously, patriarchy doesn’t advantage men so much as it advantages wealthy men, or maybe perhaps it’s better to say it advantages well-off men. But for minorities, poorer men, neurodivergent men, or trans, it’s still a hell hole as they contend with a society that treats them as disposable, and failures for being unable to provide. This shuts them off from forming meaningful relationships and social opportunities. So it advantanges certain men, and disadvantages the rest.

I think being aware of that is very important and can help win over men to the cause of Marxism, and provide common ground with women and a personal cause for men to improve their material conditions, which is insanely important.

That being said I do think looking at countries that have won their revolution, that simply reclaiming the means of production does outright improve the material conditions of men by default by improving health care, better career opportunities, and lowering income inequality. Men (particularly white men in america) are already advantaged generally under capitalism and so therefore there will be some inequality inevitable during a socialist period of government (this is consistent with what Marx says about inequalities being inevitable as capitalist infrastructure remains during transition).

So I think my answer is similar to what some other people have said already - that the base form of Marxism/socialism does much already to help men. But yeah, at some level we do need to explore ways of bringing men into the fold by exposing how patriarchy works against men, and showing how socialism benefits men. I think it’s become a bit taboo discuss this stuff and that’s probably simply because of the efforts by the ruling class to divide us, using rainbow capitalism and the alt right as ways to smear any real dialogue.

deleted by creator

So my mother is an old-school feminist. Part of the women’s army core back when that was a thing, a STEM graduate and worker in the 80’s. She’s seen some shit.

What she says about the feminist movement (and having been in three relationships now with men I agree) is that it advanced women, but men didn’t step up. Women became able to do it all, childcare, homemaking, AND working and even breadwinning. Many men took this not as an opportunity to step up and do more themselves, but as an opportunity to do less. They just let women do 50% of the work now, plus 100% of the housework. So modern women average out to doing like 75% of the work!

I can confirm that this was present in 2/3 of my relationships with men. The men involved were practically children I had to care for. They would do some work but would then spend the money on themselves and maybe give me some of it to make sure the bills got paid. They did nothing to clean or maintain the area around them. They did nothing to ensure the laundry got done or that decent food got made. Both of them I had to encourage to clean themselves. They spent the rest of their time playing video games. Sometimes for 16 hours a day if I didn’t “harass” them. I suppose I’m glad I had teenagers with part time jobs instead of something more akin to toddlers but either way they were confused when my attraction to them rapidly vanished due to their childlike behavior. I now have an actual grown man who is comfortable completing household tasks, perhaps even moreso than me. This is fine by me, as I am much more comfortable working 48+ weeks outside the home if needed.

I cannot speak to what branding would make this palatable to men, but I hope you find some way of encouraging them to see cooking, cleaning, and doing laundry, as general adult tasks instead of women’s ones. Please. For all of our sakes.

The gender divide, political or otherwise, is another classic tactic by the rich ruling class to ensure we never organise enough to overthrow them. They pit us against ourselves so we don’t attack them. If we’re to have a successful revolution, we must be a united front, not have separate competing movements along arbitrary lines like gender, race, etc.

The men’s rights shouldn’t be an offshoot. It should be an integrated part of whatever you are calling ‘left wing’. Same with feminism, of course. Why create these false dichotomies?

See other posts like: [1], [2], [3]

@meloo

The way this post is written, I would be very opposed because it puts politics before men.

deleted by creator

I’m not sure what the point would be, or what the exact plan is.

If it’s making male-only online spaces to talk about Left-Wing men’s issues, then I’m not sure what the point is, and we already have mostly-male spaces all over the internet, some of which talk about Feminism.

If the idea’s to focus on men’s issues, then we also have plenty of spaces for that already. I’ve known a few Feminists who take time to look at men’s problems (mostly women), but Feminist movements usually focus on women’s issues because the biggest problems lie there atm, at least as far as I can see (e.g. right now, Roe V Wade’s being overturned).

There’s inklings of this kind of thing already here and there, one example: https://goodmenproject.com/

I don’t think many would be opposed, there aren’t many places for men of domestic abuse. HR will take men serious when sexually harassed. etc…

A lot of issues that men face are directly because of the patriarchy so dismantling it is the only way to fight for men’s rights. Not being taken seriously in sexual assaults, not being equally considered for custody, not being able to express emotions - all of these come from the bullshit patriarchal view of strong men and weak women that the patriarchy enforces. It’s all the same fight.

Men’s rights is a fundamentally reactionary movement found solely to counter the revolutionary movement of feminism. It’s just like ‘All lives matter’. Let’s change some words in your question to expose it’s absurdity

'Not the right wing All lives matter, Some kind of left version that would fundamentally be a BLM movement but with different branding. Different branding would be necessary to absorb a bunch of white people into it.

Removed by mod