Don’t know if this goes here or in /AskLemmy, but just wanted to know the best FOSS social networks, why are there so good? What would be the propietary equivalent?

  • dstep
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    2 years ago

    Mastodon (like twitter)

    Lemmy (of course, like reddit)

    Pixelfed (instagram, but I haven’t used it)

    Also try to look at fediverse website, there you can find more.

  • mekhos
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    2 years ago

    Manyverse/Scuttlebutt is cool for the ability to function with or without internet infrastructure, it can be updated over USB sticks if really required, I like this because it works for people in very remote or developing countries.

  • sproid
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    2 years ago

    The most mature one I think is #Mastodon. Equivalent to Twitter. For Instagram alternative I love #Pixelfed. For facebook alternative I’ll say #Minds is the most mature but the problem there is lack of moderation and is home for many conspiracy theorists. There are others that try to be an alternative to Facebook but IMO need more maturing. Those are Friendica and Diaspora.

    • onlooker
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      For facebook alternative I’ll say #Minds is the most mature but the problem there is lack of moderation and is home for many conspiracy theorists.

      Adding to this, Minds also rewards their users with Ethereum, based on their interactions with the website. Very much not a fan of this. This encourages their users to post as much as possible for the sake of earning money, which results in a flood of posts, most of which are of low quality.

      On another note, how is this a facebook alternative? Looking at their discovery page, it does remind me of a certain social network, but it ain’t facebook.

      • sproid
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        There’s really not a feature by feature alternative to Facebook. Specifically not FOSS. What social network Minds remind you of?

        Disclaimer* I don’t have a Facebook account for years now, and made a Minds acc just to look it’d features.

        • onlooker
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          Give Minds a black background and some annoying popups about cookie preferences and you pretty much have Twitter.

      • GenkiFeral
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        Minds is a bit FB-like. I used them for years at a time when they had encryption as somewhat of a default (though it was confusing). I quit over 6 months ago when they changed. I might go back because I’d like to join some protest movements. I’d like to see a breakdown of what servers this social media sites are using so that censoring server co.s such as AWS/Amazon can’t pull the plug on them like was done with Parler. I love Lemmy’s large ratio of tech-savvy people, but it is certainly left-leaning and not very tolerant of other voices. I am bisexual, atheist, vegan, female, a minimalist, tree-hugger, often date outside of my race, but Lemmy members still call me a rightwinger and try to throw me out of this or that group. We need a chart outlining servers, general politcal stance, who runs it (how much it is controlled and how), if a phone number is needed and what kind of phn # is accepted, if IP is necessary, etc. These details are extremely important. EX: without ever signing in, Google/YT knows I am using TOR (and may give an error message to say as much) and also knows my IP or IMEI or possibly my mac address - some identifying fingerprint - not sure which. Also, knowing what type of encryption is avialable and if by default would help. I’ve seen a decent chart somewhere with some of that, but it needed to be more indepth.

        • Jay Baker (he/they)
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          2 years ago

          I’m pansexual, nonbinary, vegan, and anarchist, and I think it’s really important for there to be safe spaces online where the Parler type perspective is not welcome; where bigotry and hatespeech is not welcome - I agree in the sense that there has to be a transparent code of conduct so that people know what they’re signing up for, and thankfully a heck of a lot of Fediverse instances offer that.

          • GenkiFeral
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            I certainly think everyone should have a safe space, but that it needs to be a smaller, more intimiate space - such as a friend’s house would be or a private group within a social network. I hate hearing negative talk about women, yet still think incels and misogynists should have a right to their own group. Sometimes all people want is to talk out their frustrations and not act them out. Sometimes once they get that off their chest, they chill out a little bit. I’ve never been on Parler and fear the tyranny of “the Left” as much as that of “the Right”. Quite frankly, i feel squeezed uncomfortably by both sides and not allowed to be independent-minded. Call me sexist, but women seem the worst about social bullying. I guess they need larger goals in life so that they are more occupied with their own danged business to mind mine. I think we need to allow polite open discussion and not be so quick to shout someone down. Our react might be more productive if we handled it by rational discussion rather than by emotional outbursts. I don’t feel at home in a Conservative Atheist group, either - tried that and didn’t like it. But, I cannot ask others to change for me - and, can only hope they don’t expect me to change for them. I refused to change for my own family and have mostly disowned them. Why some ‘offended’ person thinks they can change me, idk why. I don’t play that shame-game. Perhaps more middle-of-the-road or Libertarian-minded people simply need to learn tech more and start their own groups so that Left and Right don’t continue to squeeze them out.

            • jackalope
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              I mean traditionally the people who were techies have generally been “middle of the road Libertarian minded people”. Just look at the founding of the EFF.

              I grew up very conservative and then became libertarian, and now I’m anarchist/socialist. I think a lot of people have had a similar journey as me in tech. Increasingly more and more tech people are waking up to the ways they’re being shafted by their bosses and they aren’t happy with it.

              In the 90s it was easy to believe in a utopian sort of capitalism. The USSR had just fallen, jobs were booming, and even after the dotcom crash, most engineers were well paid even if they weren’t particularly good at their job.

              But code boot camps, machine learning, outsourcing, the corporate harvesting of open source, have all put greater pressure on the average techie. This is why there’s so much backlash against Elon Musk, because people are starting to get tired and see through the schtick. Techno utopianism has worn thin. Where’s my mfing flying car?!

              And in addition to that, when Trump was elected, a lot of anti-racist libertarians looked around and realized how many of their “libertarian” friends who ranted all the time about “State’s Rights” were really just white supremacist chucklefucks. The Libertarian movement online has split. A lot of people went one way or the other.

              I’ve never been on Parler and fear the tyranny of “the Left” as much as that of “the Right”.

              My only issue with this is that the Left, at least in America has no power. Who is “the Left” to you? Biden? Biden is not really very Left at all. AOC? She has a platform and no power. Are you afraid of Spotify kicking Rogan off their platform? Spotify the capitalist tech monopolist that rips off artists?

              Leftists in America are basically powerless fringe weirdos.

              Whereas right wingers are literally most of our government. And they have drones and they kill people with those drones.

              • GenkiFeral
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                I like the EFF - what I know, at least. I am against the fascism of BigTech and that is what I hear you describing - though I am no political expert or tech graduate. I’ve seen how they try to replace developers with immigrants from India and China - who they also take advantage of. I think most people think of Big Biz when they think of capitalism, but in my mnd, it is a world mostly full of small businesses and mostly devoid of businesses with over 100 employees. Government is supposed to be objective about business, but is sadly very involved (in backroom deals, I’d bet). Again, I don’t know the more precice lingo. I only know that what I see scares me - that all of those chances our grandparents had to get ahead are going away. I am not sure about Elon Musk yet. It is terrifying to think that he could corner the internet market with satellite, though. I worry about AWS/Amazon cornering the server market and thus having the power to censor us. Satellite internet seems far more powerful than that. I’ve never met a white supremacist Libertarian online and have met almost no Libertarians at all in person. I was put off by a couple misogynists, but think those were broken-hearted lonely men who just needed to rant a while - even if it did hurt the women in the group. Libertarians are very, very independent types and will always be too split to go too far. I feel the same about the FOSS community. They simply don’t work too well with others and that makes it hard to get ahead sometimes. They don’t want to dominate (usually), but don’t always want to cooperate, negotiate, or compromise. I don’t know who AOC is.

                I left Spotify because of censorship already, but still hate how they are treating Joe Rogan - though I never watch his show.

                I think the lines are quite blurred about who or which co. is capitalist or just opportunist or leftist. I prefer tthe term fascist for co. such as Amazon, Facebook, and Google. If you get help or forgiveness from the gov’t, that is fascism and I hate it. It is tyranny and deprives others of a fair chance to compete. I realize there many shades of grey and I thought Trump was a moderate Republican (he used to be a Democrat) and that many Democrats can be as greedy as any Republican. The Left is cancel-culture and gets people fired or not promoted- people who aren’t always celebs. They censor people. Its a modern-day witch burning or Maoist weeding out of anyone would disagrees. I think of Biden as Left, but what degree is he? idk. He’s nothing but a figurehead like most presidents are. I think the Left would be largely without power if the Right wouldn’t be so domineering…and, vice versa. Its like being kids and watching your parents have a big fight that continues to escalate to the point of insanity - each trying to out-maneveur or out-do the other. The kids just stand by cringing, thinking, “holy shit, I have the DNA of both of those lunatics”. You both hate them and begin to hate yourself for being a reluctant passive party to it. But, I also think conglomerates and other BIGGG players (central banks, IMF, WEF) are controlling or heavily influencing the left and right. They bait the Left and Right and the fools take the bait. They divide and conquer and are a bit outside of that Left or Right box.
                I think that group is the one with drones, and the ones who orchestrate those wars. i fear another war within the next 5 years - maybe including Russia, Ukraine, and the Middle East. I suppose we ‘need’ more oil, so need that land access to where the oil pipelines will go. I say “need”. because most Americans have far too much crap already.

                • jackalope
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                  I think most people think of Big Biz when they think of capitalism, but in my mnd, it is a world mostly full of small businesses and mostly devoid of businesses with over 100 employees.

                  The only problem with this, is that it is objectively false: https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/big-business-is-getting-bigger/

                  Concentration of ownership in business is at highs we haven’t seen since the Gilded Age. That isn’t even an opinion, it’s a measurable fact.

                  I don’t think you’re really understanding what people mean when they talk about “capitalism”. Capitalism isn’t simply “big business” or “small business” or even “government versus business”, because Capitalism is enforced and upheld by Government. Here is a short video by an economics professor that might help clarify what leftists mean when they talk about “capitalism”

                  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XnY_ZqJ64cI

                  I think of Biden as Left, but what degree is he?

                  You might consider him left but Leftists, or at least the kind of people who self identify as Leftists on Lemmy would disagree with you strongly.

                  But, I also think conglomerates and other BIGGG players (central banks, IMF, WEF) are controlling or heavily influencing the left and right. They bait the Left and Right and the fools take the bait. They divide and conquer and are a bit outside of that Left or Right box.

                  No, the IMF, central banks, and WEF are capitalists. They are right wing. They are exactly what Leftists oppose. They are not outside of divide between Left and Right. They ARE the basis of opposition. You are literally complaining about Capitalism.

                • Jay Baker (he/they)
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                  The current obsession with “cancel culture” is a constant cause of amusement for me. It’s largely a myth born out of the far right’s attempt to push back against progress on LGBTQ+ issues, BIPOC anti-oppression, etc and it’s only very slightly clever in the sense that it’s caught on. Whereas 5, 10, 15 years ago “cancel culture” was simply referred to as…consequences: Someone did something scandalous, or disgraceful, and people were in uproar, and withheld their custom, and basically boycotted. But as an attempt to protect their bigoted (and increasingly inappropriate and outdated) views, right-wingers have attempted to rebrand consequences as “cancel culture” - and it’s caught on. And if it’s successful? Well then people will be able to get away with saying or doing what they want with consequences eliminated; they’ll be able to get away with, abusing, harassing, tormenting, torturing, or inciting hatred as much as they want, again, without consequence - and that fascism becomes the dominant culture (yes, we’ve been here before in history). But that’s basically what the aim of the rebrand is. It’s pretty simple, if not obvious.

            • Jay Baker (he/they)
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              Interesting. I guess it depends on how people define “left” and “right” and whether they see them as having equal dominance in our capitalist world. Some claim China to be communist whereas it’s essentially state capitalism and still an oppressive hierarchical system. I am essentially, I guess, what people might define as a libertarian socialist or anarcho-communist, so some might see me as very leftist, whereas others still claim Corbynistas or Bernie supporters or even Democrats in general are leftist - many social democrats and even centre-right politicians claim to be socialists or leftists.

              Centrism has protected the capitalist status quo for so long it’s arguably stifled meaningful alternatives and contributed to the emergence of Brexit, Trump, Bolsonaro, conspiracy theorists, Covid denialists, and fascism. Free speech doesn’t include hate speech. Those intolerant views shouldn’t be tolerated because that itself leads to the eradication of tolerance (too numerous examples from history on that one).

              To push safe spaces into the shadows is to cede ground culturally to such bigotry - in fact, the bigotry is what must be pushed away, with no room to breathe. In a fairer, non-hierarchical, anarchist society, rather than the current capitalist status quo of destruction, I think people’s troubles would be tackled, and we’d find people weren’t, at their core, intolerant or bigoted, they were just discontent and couldn’t comprehend why. Fascism preys on the poor and exploits their irrational fears.

              We must ask ourselves what kind of world we want to live in, and act on it - “build the new world in the shell of the old.” So codes of conduct and safe spaces online are really very important, and the broader they become, the more common they become, and the more positive change is achieved.

              • GenkiFeral
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                look: the cancel-culture has gone too far! I agreed with Whoopi saying Jews are white. i had a fling with a Syrian Sephardi jew (hung like a camel - to quote his own cousin) and he was WHITE. not as pale as me and maybe a bit darker-skinned than most Ashkenazim, but he and they are/were white. that is a neutral statement and neither good nor bad. its a fact - although scientists say race as we describe it today is incorrect and that there is only the human race, but people only like science when they cherrypick facts. Some Jews say they aren’t a race (again, race is scientifically inaccurate0, but an ethnicity. So, on job or gov’t applications, does it list Jew as ethncity? If so, where is Slav? Slavs are the largest ethnic group in Europe and often the butt of jokes (Poles, at least). Or, Mayan. Mayans aren’t Mexican, but Mayan and once had their own nation. Mayans aren’t Incan…many Incans and Mayans are now Mexican, but they have their own ethnicity. Not all native Americans share the same DNA - mainly since there were 2+ Berengian crossings…so, many tribes have their own ethnicty. So, why are Jews able to suspend Whoopi? I am no fan of Whoopi, but she said nothing wrong. Whoopi is an example among many. People talk about ableism, yet autistic people and some personality types have some trouble differentiating these new isms, these tiny distinctions. Why was it okay for a doctor to label a patient ‘mentally removed’ 20 years ago, but the same doctor today would be called politically incorrect for calling a man with Down’s Syndrome ‘mentally removed’ when he works in a facility with others who are ‘mentally removed’ but do not have Down’s Syndrome. They are in a subgroup. Why can I get called ethnocentric (or worse) for saying eating dogs in the USA should remain illegal, but when a Korean (a few said it) says it, he is just stating an opinion. Supposedly, because Asians (and now some Africans) eat dogs and cats in their native lands, they think they should be able to eat them here, too…and breed or cage them for meat. Those are just examples. But, I promised myself upon signing up that I wouldn’t discuss controversial topics, but here I am breaking my own rule.

        • jackalope
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          That’s a fair point but I think it’s important to create some clear distinctions here in how this these software projects are analyzed and compared.

          lemmy.ml is a left leaning community. There is nothing about lemmy itself, it’s design or implementation that make it left leaning inherently. If a right winger wanted to start a lemmy instance they could.

          • GenkiFeral
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            hmmm, good idea. a libertarian instance might be nice. I dislike left and right equally. Both are too demanding and intrusive. i’ll let the right do thier own thing without me.

              • GenkiFeral
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                less censorship. less “that’s not okay here”. less throwing around of sentences or words that are meant to silence you (as though by silencing you, that changes you!). Smacking people over the head with your “truth” works for some, but makes enemies of others. Libertarians usually don’t do that. They discuss things and each of us learns or understands better - even if we don’t change our minds, we don’t shut down conversation and can become more tolerant because now we understand how the other feels or thinks without the drama of name-calling, crying/shouting, shunning/shame…those are manipulative tactics that insult one’s intelligence. There has been a feeling on most social media that what I say is being logged to be used against me for the cancel-culture to use and/or that I cannot speak freely. I’ve almost given up on social media…or, on humans. Lemmy.ml isn’t so far left that I cannot handle it, but I really like open dialogue and think I am open-minded enough to learn from it - if it is presented in a logical, precise, timely (blunt, short) manner.

                • Jay Baker (he/they)
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                  I think there’s a difference between censorship and safe spaces if there are codes of conduct and everyone knows what they’re signing up for. With the current dominance of capitalism, neoliberalism, and the rising threat of the far right, I have no desire to spend my time online in areas where that’s merely reflected and regurgitated. In fact, the only reason I joined Lemmy was because I understood it to be leftist or anarchist friendly and I’m really utterly sick and tired of seeing FOSS forums infested with intolerance and hate speech. So the idea of a space where people can just ignore pronouns, or use transphobic, sexist, racist, ableist, antisemitic, Islamophobic language because to stop them is labeled “cancel culture” is quite abhorrent to me, though there are loads of such places online already existing and thriving. Telegram is full of white supremacist and bigoted channels and groups and the far right flow freely through corporate media, so if I can just for once not have to deal with that shit, that’d be nice. (Thanks Lemmy, keep up the good work)

  • onlooker
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    2 years ago

    just wanted to know the best FOSS social networks

    Depends on your definition of “best”. There’s a good number of them and the only way to find out which is best for you is to try them out. You might want to start looking here.

    What would be the propietary equivalent?

    Facebook, Twitter, Instagram, TikTok, etc.

  • ajr
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    deleted by creator

    • IanThePirateOP
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      Yep, I use AlternativeTo but couldn’t find what I was searching… Because not all the information is in there

  • Vostronix
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    I need a good client this is combining Mastodon, Matrix and Jitsi more I don’t need, OK maybe Lemmy :) I like Telegram because this is combining all this things. Also its can be kind of a Lemmy because you have Side Threads in Groups wehre you can talk about a other Topic

  • GenkiFeral
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    Telegram might be okay. It offers decryption, but that function must be turned on - for private chat, i think. it does have groups such as crytpo groups for this or that state or country or for a certain software. It does require a phone number, though. Because bots post so much spam, many social networking sites are asking for more and more verification, but that hurts user as much as it does the bot-spammer. I don’t now the answer to that other than a bunch of whitehat hackers taking down the bots/spammers and locking their computers somehow.

    • GenkiFeral
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      MeWe is a good part-time or temporary alternative, but judging by all of the covid-19 warnings the company would post, they are biased and would turn into a FB-overlord the moment they had enough users to be able to afford censoring. As far FOSS not selling your data, some of those FOSS companies may coolect data (some more than others) and then later sell the compnay to a for-profit company and then your data belongs to maybe an ad company. Did you know that on most distros (not Debian, i think), the DE KDE sells your metadata to Google everytime you use Kate or a few other apps? I understand the need for market research to see if users like this or that, but there is much room for exploitation. Therefore, KDE is not trustworthy - despite being FOSS. Same goes for some other FOSS products or services. Question everything. No blind faith, no lazy all-or-nothing thinking. Staying free requires mental effort.