I’m determined to hold out for as long as I can, but these days you need a QR code for everything from ordering at a restaurant to boarding a flight
Kohen Shaw
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Prolly I’ll be in the minority here. But blaming the tech itself seems the wrong way to go. Technology advance and adoption has been part of our species for thousands of years, and this is no different. So needing certain tech to do our every day human activities is normal. We should focus our attention towards what large companies who control this tech (mostly) are doing with this and how they are using it in order to control us and profit from us.

A de-googled android smartphone will get rid of most of the issues caused by large tech, and still retain most of the advantages. Sadly de-googled android is not consumer - ready yet though, so it’s a real option for the more technically inclined. But then again, this might be an issue more related to technical literacy?

poVoq
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Most of the bank apps don’t work on de-googled Android phones however.

@Arcadius
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But you need the app or a tan generator to login with many banks now. The app works as a second factor authenticator in that instance, which the website can’t do

@Arcadius
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musicmatze
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You even need an app for accessing your bank account. At least in the EU!

@nutomic
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My bank just sends SMS codes for verification, no app needed (Spain).

musicmatze
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It’s an EU norm, not yet unforced AFAIK, but mobileTAN will be removed anytime soon. My bank(s) removed it mid 2021 and introduced mandatory apps or TAN generator.

same happened to me. Now I can choose if I want to purchase a tan generator or use the app

poVoq
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That is mostly false info banks like to tell their customers as their shitty apps allow them to shift the burden of proof in some fraud cases to the customers and also allow them to outsource some customer relation parts.

The relevant new EU legislation only requires there to be a second factor for authentication, but does not require an smart-phone app at all.

Look for a more honest bank with better customer service would be my advise. My bank does have an app as well, but it isn’t required at all.

musicmatze
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AFAIK the other option as second factor is a tan generator that one has to buy. I don’t know of any bank in Germany that has another second factor or will provide one in the future

@onlooker
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Tell me about it. Apparently there are some banks that still allow you to pay for stuff online without having to own a phone. Unfortunately, my country has exactly zero of them. I checked. All our banks now need their app on their customers’ phone to verify their online purchases. And I don’t have a Play Store on my phone, so that’s fun.

musicmatze
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Think of all the old people that do not know how to use a smartphone and don’t want one …

@onlooker

@musicmatze

How did we get there?

@ksynwa
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You mean for accessing your bank account from a phone? Or just accessing your account in general?

musicmatze
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In General, because you need an app as second factor.

@kixik
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How about code being sent through SMS? Or using an OTH token, or something not forcing an app? Where I live, what’s worse about those token apps, is that some do not work if not under google play. Some do, but most don’t. I had to show them their app didn’t work in a LOS4uG phone (no GApps at all), and they sold me the OATH token, they were not even going to sell it to me, because banks are enforcing the app, which to me it’s a horrible practice. But banks are private entities, so I don’t know if there can be legal actions filed against those practices, though I’m no lawyer, neither I have time, neither money to start such demands, but I’m thinking it should be possible.

In my country the government is also trying to enforce QR codes through an app, right now the enforcement was put on pause, given an action filed against it, but I’m suspecting it’ll still be enforced in the end… It’s sad to see where things are moving…

musicmatze
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SMS as 2FA is not allowed anymore in the EU starting some time in 2022, IIRC. Not 100% sure though.

@musicmatze

@kixik

Do you have a source?

@ArtilectZed
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@kixik
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But this are randomly generated numbers, short term lived. They don’t make any sense to anyone, if not having the other authentication factors, in the multi factor authentication. That’s why they are multi factor (2nd in most cases). And those banks token apps, I guess they provide client server encryption, which bumps up security on the token sent a bit, but in my mind not enough to say just because you receive SMS tokens, it’s quite easy to get into you bank account, without having all authentication factors at hand, and all the time, remember those tokens are short lived.

@ArtilectZed
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@kixik
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But QR codes can be printed out, can’t they? As long as holding your ID, and the printed thing, wouldn’t that be enough?

In the state I live in, they are rolling out virtual IDs.

@3arn0wl
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