Lately I have been watching a friend play BioShock Infinite, something to which I paid little attention at the time of its release. At first the setting and the story were attracting me, as they pertain to my field of interest… but later in the story, after acquainting us with an archetypal capitalist, I noticed that the story was getting a little ‘darker’—in a familiar way—and it soon devolved into what I feared: another subplot about how much revolution sucks.

I’ve seen it already in The Young Indiana Jones Chronicles and Metro 2033, so I know how it goes: first the writers lure you in with a display of the prerevolutionary situation, and at first they portray the revolutionaries positively, but as the climax approaches the revolutionaries go around suddenly committing atrocities without any clear rhyme or reason, nothing can be done to prevent it, ordinary people hate it (so the revolutionaries abuse them too), and the lesson is that revolution is no better than the prerevolutionary situation.

Why do revolutionaries go through the trouble of making revolution? Not because the material conditions (whatever those are) made revolution inevitable, no. It’s because revolutionaries are stupid and unreasonable. Simple as that. That’s probably also why they commit atrocities, and also why they can’t figure out how to keep their supporters without resorting to coercion or violence.

The message, it seems, is an advertisement for conservatism: ‘Yes, we’ll admit that things may be awful now, but no matter how awful they may be, anything else would be worse, so just shut up and do nothing.’ They don’t state it outright—possibly because of how embarrassing it would look—but that is the only conclusion that I can draw. (Otherwise, the only alternatives are either that the writers wanted to subject innocent people to their angsty, immature whining, or they simply wanted to waste their time, both of which would be bafflingly unwise of them.)

Is there anything inaccurate about my observation? Because otherwise, I don’t know why these presumed professionals would suddenly subject us to this lazy and shallow writing.

  • knfrmity@lemmygrad.mlEnglish
    41·
    2 years ago

    These revolutionary type storylines are definitely written like that on purpose. I’m noticing more and more that the “villain” of a story often starts out quite relatable, they want something that most of us want or at least understand, they want a more equitable and humane society in many ways. And then all of a sudden, for no reason at all in terms of the story narrative, they do something violent, and then they’re definitely the “bad guy” cause they did violence. Often the “good guy” even says that they agree with the “bad guy” in principal, but if only they just went about it in a different way - namely non-violent reform, asking the government nicely, etc.

    This is just another way in which the cultural hegemony of capitalism reinforces the perception that there is no alternative, and if you want to improve things you must work within the bounds of the system, lest you realize that it’s the system itself which is the problem.

  • SomeGuy@lemmygrad.ml
    35·
    2 years ago

    Maybe its because that’s how the American revolution turned out. High promises that were ultimately dashed with all of the ideas that made people willing to fight for it abandoned and suppressed. Just compare Thomas Paine’s writings with the reality of what the US became and its night and day. He was basically the chief theoretician of the US revolution being read across the country but when it actually came time for the government to follow through on those promises it simply became an even more entrenched aristocratic system. The founding fathers pushed him far away from any chance at government power and slandered him hard to make sure that even long after his death, people like Theodore Roosevelt would still run his name through the mud.

    Hell, even reading Paine today he’d be seen as a radical in many respects. Media would probably wrongly call him a socialist though he is closer to a social democrat but someone who is equivalent to a modern social democrat existing in the late 1700s is extremely radical. If he was raised today I’m fully convinced he’d be an ML.

    • SovereignState@lemmygrad.ml
      20·
      2 years ago

      Paine was pretty based for his time. Socialist and union groups in the fledgling U.S. were attacked as “Painite”, and his writings on slavery still slap.

  • NothingButBits@lemmygrad.ml
    33·
    2 years ago

    You’re on point. American media is anti-revolution. I still remember a line from Stargate Atlantis where the leader of the project states that nearly all revolutions end up worse than what they had before. It’s constant propaganda drilled down into people.

      • Black AOC@lemmygrad.mlEnglish
        34·
        2 years ago

        I started cutting people off for trying to talk to me about that movie. I’ve not been able to give a fuck about Marvel since the Avengers replaced the X-Men as the ‘front-and-center’ cape team; but when the Black Panther movies started dropping, that’s when my DGAF metastasized into outright, total hatred.

        Imagine naming a cape after the single most radical organization America has ever known, and then having that cape be the same Pentagon collaborating, military-industrial complex bootlicking piece of shit all your other capes are.

        • ☭CommieWolf☆@lemmygrad.mlEnglish
          39·
          2 years ago

          Part of me believes there’s a conspiracy to separate these names from their roots. If you look up Black Panther now you’ll most likely have to sift through a load of capeshit till you find anything about the movement.

          And recently Marvel announced a film about an Israeli hero called “Sabra” which is the name of a town where occupation forces committed one of the biggest massacres in its history. So if you look up “Sabra Israel” you’ll first see some shitty Israeli Hummus brand, then marvel crap, and only then do you find something about the massacre.

          • Black AOC@lemmygrad.mlEnglish
            31·
            2 years ago

            Ohhhhhhhhh, so this is a pattern of malevolent action on Marvel’s part. Just fuckin lovely.

          • redshiftedbrazilian@lemmygrad.mlEnglish
            13·
            2 years ago

            The comic Black Panther was named at the same time of the movement and had no relationship. So I dont think that was the ORIGINAL idea, but cant say the same thing for modern day movies specially with the Sabra bullshit you gave as an example

        • redtea@lemmygrad.mlEnglish
          16·
          2 years ago

          I was expecting big things with that film. It became the go to example in so many books on race and decolonisation. I was hesitant but looking forward to it. What a disappointment. Jfc.

          • PolandIsAStateOfMind@lemmygrad.mlEnglish
            211·
            2 years ago

            Same. I remember polish internet crying “It’s full of antiwhite racism!!!” so i watched it, and there was racism, but it was just the standard murican one.

            • redtea@lemmygrad.mlEnglish
              14·
              2 years ago

              Yes, but then the CIA guy shows us the US isn’t racist, actually. This is good because now I can sleep soundly again, knowing that even when it’s the bad guy the US is really the good guy.

              • Shrike502@lemmygrad.mlEnglish
                14·
                2 years ago

                even when it’s the bad guy the US is really the good guy.

                Sounds like a plot for most of those movies

      • redshiftedbrazilian@lemmygrad.mlEnglish
        19·
        2 years ago

        The one I hate the most is the Falcon/Winter Soldier series. Halfway through the series a black man that was tortured and experimented on by the US government tells Falcon this about becoming the captain america:

        “No self-respecting black man would ever wear these symbols”

        And he is fucking right, but you know what is the resolution to his storyline?? Falcon inaugurates a statue with a 3 paragraph text explaining his story in a museum dedicated to the Oeiginal captain america. Literally a footnote on the history of the “great myth” of Captain America.

        Its so ironic and infuriating bc that is exactly how Americans treat any of their past horrendous crimes. Its just a footnote on their history at best.

        Native americans genocide? That was long time ago…

        Slavery? Oh but the civil war…

        Two fucking nukes on civilians? Not war crime because WWII or some shit

        Concentration camps for japanese? Philippines genocide? Colonization on the Pacific? Apartheid? Imperialist agressions? Wiping out whole nations? Chemical weapons? Persecution of black movements? Radiation poisoning of native people on the pacific? Torture centers? Police brutallity? Keeping the whole world under surveillance?

        That’s bad, sure, but fuck China because Mao killed some feudal lords I guess 🥰#blm

        • knfrmity@lemmygrad.mlEnglish
          15·
          2 years ago

          Not to mention the main “villains” of the show. All they wanted was a dignified life for everyone, but fuck them I guess cause they got angry and killed a few cops. So much for human dignity, you didn’t ask the billionaire overlords nicely so forget about it.

          Also the intro of the new Avengers manager type character. There was probably lots wrong with Sam Jackson’s Nick Fury but he seemed neutral enough as far as Marvel goes. Julia Louis Dreyfus’ character on the other hand… Is she supposed to be Madeline Albright or Hillary Clinton or something?

          • Shrike502@lemmygrad.mlEnglish
            11·
            2 years ago

            Is she supposed to be Madeline Albright or Hillary Clinton or something?

            Reee #itwasherturn you bigot! /s

            Also, funny little unrelated bit, since we’re on Marvel talk: there was this (cancelled short) series called Newuniversal, by Warren Ellis. Now Ellis is your typical British “enlightened” lib, but he did some bangers in the past. So in this series, which is set in a parallel (to the main one) universe, Hillary is president and authorizes NSA to begin a massive program for locating and exterminating emerging super-powered people. Funniest shit.

            • Shrike502@lemmygrad.mlEnglish
              9·
              2 years ago

              Funny you should mention that particular movie. See, they did an oopsie there, what with having Hydra being in charge of US intelligence community, sowing chaos worldwide to ensure their new order is accepted and all that.

              Thing is, if you pause for even a minute after that, you’ll find yourself thinking “wait, if USA and shield have been under the bad guys since the 1950’s at least, doesn’t that mean USSR were the good guys?”

              The studio must have realised that as well, because they’ve backtracked in the third movie. They’ve introduced a stereotypical russkie bad guy character (ever noticed how they’re always made ugly?), a secret hydra base in Russia, those secret super soldier assassins, etc etc. All for the single purpose - to wash away the concerns.

              • redshiftedbrazilian@lemmygrad.mlEnglish
                7·
                2 years ago

                I think that the movie has a “libertarian” vibe to it. In the end, Steve speeches are how they will defeat the government because he believes in “freedom” and trust “individuals”, so I’d say it’s the classic broken clock that is right twice a day.

                And in the end they destroy SHIELD but keep the Avengers and every other government institution running, so the problem was never the status quo, the problem is that it was not the “true america” because it was full of nazis 🤓

                Ironicaly Captain America 2 is partially responsible for my radicalization bc its the reason I know Edward Snowden and his revelations about NSA

        • Black AOC@lemmygrad.mlEnglish
          12·
          2 years ago

          Real talk: Sam Wilson, if he wasn’t a cape, would’ve been another one of these ladder-pulling misleaders that graduated from a Divine Nine frat the way damn near every misleader I’ve ever known did(you can’t trust the modern-day Boulé or their adjacencies), moved his whole family out the hood and into some hwhite gated community to ‘keep his kids from running the streets’, and from there, would eventually end up some do-nothing politician in the Congressional Black Caucus. Honestly fuck him and anyone who backs him.

  • loathsome dongeater@lemmygrad.mlEnglish
    26·
    2 years ago

    I liked what Disco Elysium did. The situation sucked but it was because of fairly complex and materialist reasons rather than just because of revolution being inherently bad.

    I don’t know what goes on the in minds of writers of AAA video games but they do tend to reproduce bourgeois ideology. Bioshock Infinite does this as you noted. The new Harry Potter game does this too. I wouldn’t expect publicly traded corporations being capable of anything better. Usually indie games have more sober writing.

    I don’t have a broad understanding of trends because I do not play as much as I would like to but this is what I have noticed.

  • cayde6ml@lemmygrad.ml
    22·
    2 years ago

    This trope always drives me up the wall.

    And TV Tropes LOVES to trot this out about real-life incidents.

      • knfrmity@lemmygrad.ml
        9·
        2 years ago

        The books are much better than the TV series in terms of the politics and social commentaries, at least in my memory it was like that. I wouldn’t say it’s out and out leftist but there’s some stuff with revolutionary praxis, alternative power structures, looking at the effects of colonialism on the colonized.

        • PolandIsAStateOfMind@lemmygrad.ml
          111·
          2 years ago

          Idk if the show is better, probably not since it’s shorter, but the books are literally like the OP wrote, the “leftism” there is mostly Belters being anarchists with socialdarwnism characteristics, including the murderer of billions Marco Inaros having quite big support (he killed poor people on Earth, corpo richies came out unscathed). Actually it’s in the show that Inaros gets condemned even by the more militant groups. There was iirc one anarcho-SR-like armed group in book included that did some vague socialist propaganda, but they were quickly told to be “extremists” and also they had very little pagetime, just two or three mentions.

          there’s some stuff with revolutionary praxis, alternative power structures, looking at the effects of colonialism on the colonized.

          There are, but the end result of those issues being put on question is always liberalism, individualism and capitalism, like again when the Belters gained selfdetermination finally, they formed nearly monopolistic space transport guild-corporation.

  • AgreeableLandscape☭@lemmygrad.mlEnglish
    11·
    2 years ago

    This is what I call the paradox of revolution.

    Things that are generally agreed to be good (with a few vocal “”“critics”“”) and was gained at least in part through revolution, riots, or other violent societal pressure by the people:

    • Every single modern republic that was won from the old absolute monarchies.

    • Freeing slaves

    • Women’s rights

    • People of colour’s rights

    • LGBTQ+ rights

    • The paradigm that a criminal defendent is innocent until proven guilty

    • Freedom of religion (and the freedom to not believe in a religion)

    • Ending the holocaust and the Axis Powers

    • Five-day work week, child labour prohibition, and other worker’s rights

    • Almost all of the other major legal protections and regulations we enjoy today

    BUT, any more revolution, no matter how good the cause, is unacceptable. Obviously.

      • MarxStuff@lemmygrad.ml
        6·
        2 years ago

        you probably don’t want to read it if the already present ‘‘gommunisn BAD’’ of the games was too much.

        the book is full of genuinely enraging, anti-communist, george orwell-stan type of fanfiction about the cartoonishly evil, baby-eating totalitarian Red Line. It’s so damn out of left field that by consequence the whole thing ends up feeling more sympathetic to the nazis the author is trying to both-sides them with because it spends more time antagonizing the communist faction than anything else. hell, the sequel game to 2033, Metro Redux, baits you into thinking that the antagonists are going to be the literal skull-measuring fascists of the Fourth Reich but then has you massacring endless waves of the heinous communist horde for three quarters of the whole campaign. Ugh, no fucking wonder why ukrops and other reactionaries love this franchise.

        • SovereignState@lemmygrad.ml
          5·
          2 years ago

          Thanks for reminding of this. I remember really liking the Metro games when I was younger, and I completely forgot about the incredible amount of anti-communism. I remember liking that there were communists in it but wishing I could side with them, then understanding they weren’t reaaal communists since they were doing a genocide or whatever and it was ok to kill them, totally buying into the world building of the game uncritically, as if communists like the Red Line could ever actually exist and weren’t just an amalgamation of more than a few shitty tropes stitched together by some anti-communist hack.

  • Salamander@mander.xyz
    9·
    2 years ago

    Wow, thanks.

    In my mind, I do see the concept of a revolution that way - a revolution that topples the power structures creates a power vacuum. This leads to instability and for a competition to fill that void. The idea is that the people who have a better chance of winning the race to fill those voids are those who are willing to exploit the most effective tools of power - violence, oppression, and reward. So, a revolution creates an instability that is likely to be exploited by the greedy to the detriment of others.

    But I have never been in a revolution. My ideas of what a revolution looks like comes from that trope that you mention - movies, video games, and novels will narrate these dynamics, and through repeated exposure to this logical sequence it has come to feel natural.

    You bringing up this point makes me re-consider what I believe. On the one hand, I do not think that these ideas are fully invented - they make sense, and many revolutions in history have indeed followed this trope, and a revolution will cause an instability that will hurt people, so I am not going to do a 180 and throw away all my intuition about the topic.

    However, it is also obvious that reality is a lot more nuanced, and it makes sense that these tropes can be used to highlight and re-inforce the negative aspects of a revolution. It is good to think about that.