Greta Tankberg countdown: countdown

Edit: 170 comments doggirl-gloom

  • Thordros [he/him, comrade/them]@hexbear.net
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    20 days ago

    Having met Greta through our respective autism support communities, it feels weird that I still think of her as a kid. She can buy alcohol now!

    I had a good feeling she’d end up a comrade.

    • REgon [they/them]@hexbear.net
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      20 days ago

      She’s been able to buy alcohol for three years

      Yeah I’ve heard good things about her from people who have met her too, glad to see it reflected here

  • FunkyStuff [he/him]@hexbear.net
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    20 days ago

    She’s amazing.

    Has she ever pointed out that the main economic reason that the US needs Israel is to destabilize Middle Eastern countries with large oil reserves? I think that’s a really powerful argument for her audience and I’m a little sad not to see her explain that connection here.

    • vovchik_ilich [he/him]@hexbear.net
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      20 days ago

      Honestly, I’m glad to see a change. For all my life, I’ve heard “oil oil oil” behind every US action, and while that might be part of the thing, it’s far from the whole picture and her tweet calling imperialism by its name is kinda what we need if you ask me

      • FunkyStuff [he/him]@hexbear.net
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        20 days ago

        True, but imperialism is a pretty abstract concept and a general audience always does better to understand what it means concretely. Most people think imperialism means any kind of military conflict between a big country and a small country, not the monopoly stage of capitalism.

  • ClimateChangeAnxiety [he/him, they/them]@hexbear.net
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    20 days ago

    There is no doubt that one of the candidates - Trump - is way more dangerous than the other

    In no way judging Greta here, but I have doubts I-was-saying

    Dick Cheney scares me far more than Donald Trump does. Cheney has caused far more death and destruction, and is much more effective in his evil deeds. When both candidates are pro-war and genocide, I think the side with Dick Cheney’s endorsement scares me more.

    This is compounded by the fact that Republicans face more opposition than Democrats when they do evil things, and Trump more than the average Republican. Do you think the George Floyd protests would’ve been nearly as big if Biden had been president at the time? Absolutely not. Both at an institutional and public level, Trump, by nature of being icky, pisses people off and it makes his schemes harder to pull off. When Biden does the exact same things, he does them to thunderous applause.

    Roe was overturned under Biden. More people have been deported by Biden. Biden ended covid protections, and more people have died from covid because of him. And most importantly, Biden is the architect of the Gazan genocide.

    I’ve said before that voting for Kamala over Trump is voting to re-elect Hitler to prevent Goebbels from getting into office, but I’m starting to think it’s more like voting for Hitler to prevent Kaiser Wilhelm from getting back into office. Like yeah, he sucked dick and did a bunch of evil shit, but Hitler is currently doing the Holocaust.

    • LeninsBeard [he/him]@hexbear.net
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      20 days ago

      I don’t really get the idea that people are somehow going to be ‘more against’ the genocide in Gaza because Trump is in office. Sure, people protested for George Floyd. You know what they didn’t protest at all? The killing of Soleimani. In fact I can’t think of a single foreign policy initiative that liberals protested other than the visit with Kim Jong-Un, the only good foreign policy thing that Trump did during his presidency.

      The people that are currently protesting the Gaza genocide will continue to protest no matter who is in office. The people who are not are not going to have some sort of come to Jesus moment because the cheeto got elected.

      • The killing of Soleimani. In fact I can’t think of a single foreign policy initiative that liberals protested other than the visit with Kim Jong-Un, the only good foreign policy thing that Trump did during his presidency.

        yes

        glory DPRK

      • PKMKII [none/use name]@hexbear.net
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        20 days ago

        If history is any guide, at best they’ll protest the procedure of Trump’s support of the genocide. Trump won’t follow some meaningless rubber stamping process of the shipping of arms to Israel and then the libs will say “this is wrong we’re against this” but not because of the genocide but because Trump didn’t follow the by-laws of supporting a genocide.

        • PolandIsAStateOfMind@lemmygrad.ml
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          19 days ago

          but because Trump didn’t follow the by-laws of supporting a genocide.

          Current administration also don’t, Biden pushed arms shipment around procedures and Blinken completely lawlessly blocked recognition of human rights violations (mildly speaking) which would automatically stop weapon shipments.

      • ClimateChangeAnxiety [he/him, they/them]@hexbear.net
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        20 days ago

        Oh yeah to be clear I do not think it will change the math on Gaza that much. I meant all of the issues generally, but immigration is the main one I think Trump is actually the lesser evil on.

        Biden deported more people than Trump. They’ve managed to actually implement Trump’s immigration policy, which when Trump attempted to do he was unable to, due to opposition from both Dem politicians and the general public. I think Dems have greater freedom to be strict on immigration than Republicans do, because when Dems do it everyone falls in line.

        • LeninsBeard [he/him]@hexbear.net
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          20 days ago

          Yeah fair on immigration especially. I have doubts that Trump would be able to ram through some of the policies that Biden has gotten through, especially if Democrats take control of the house.

          ETA: I generally have the opinion that Trump winning and the Democrats taking control of the house is the “best” thing that could happen, but I have zero faith that anything will change foreign-policy wise no matter who wins this election.

        • AcidSmiley [she/her]@hexbear.net
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          20 days ago

          They’ve managed to actually implement Trump’s immigration policy, which when Trump attempted to do

          When it worked for “we actually built the wall that Trump promised”, why wouldn’t that repeat with “we actually did the mass deportations that Trump called for”? Lesser evilism doesn’t work either way, things get worse from legislature to legislature under either party. Republicans are more adapt at pushing boundaries, Democrats are more adapt at technocratic efficiency. These things are not at odds with each other, they tie into each other and are both part of the same machinery.

      • FunkyStuff [he/him]@hexbear.net
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        20 days ago

        The war is gonna escalate, and under Trump the liberal media is gonna be allowed to criticize his handling (under Biden they aren’t allowed). That’s enough for quite a lot more Gen X and millenials who get their news from the TV or from the NYT to feel a leftwards push.

      • REgon [they/them]@hexbear.net
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        20 days ago

        People were going mad about kids in cages too, and the drone bombings for a little while. Not to mention civil rights. But yeah the one time he was “presidential” was when he dropped a big bomb in the middle east.

        I still think he’s better though, but that’s because he’s a buffoon and an isolationist. I think we’d still be in Afghanistan if it hadn’t been for him

        • Frank [he/him, he/him]@hexbear.net
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          20 days ago

          Some lib told me that Biden ended the drone war and I shot back “why are there burning MQ-9s all over Yemen” and they picked up the goal posts and started sprinting with them.

      • AcidSmiley [she/her]@hexbear.net
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        20 days ago

        The people that are currently protesting the Gaza genocide will continue to protest no matter who is in office.

        Absolutely, but Trump will spend more time demonizing them as antisemitic terrorist supporters. He’s always been rabidly zionist and has always loved using leftist grassroots movements as a bogeyman, he’s not gonna pass that opportunity up. Idk if that would translate into more actual repression against them, but islamophobia dressed up as fighting terrorism traditionally has a lot of traction in the US, and i do not see the Dems pushing back against that even if they would control both houses after the midterms, genocide support is a bipartisan issue after all and they will falter when Trump links the Dems to the protests like he did with BLM. It’s also possible that Trump lays the ideological groundwork for more effective anti-left policies under a Dem presidency from 2028-2032. He’s good at normalizing atrocities, and the Dems have shown to be eager to then implement that (see also: deportations and the Dems bragging about how they actually built the wall that Trump promised). There can absolutely be a ratchet effect in this regard.

        I could also see Trump being more supportive of the genocide itself. More bombs, more open endorsement, more troops on the ground. Biden has already sent missile defense crews there, i think this still has potential for escalation, as hard as that is to imagine for many people here.

        Mind you, i’m not doing a lesser evilism here, it’s the morally correct choice not to pick between hand-wringing and enthusiastic genocide, but to treat this as a line that can’t be crossed either way. But it’s absolutely possible that things will get worse in this regard under Trump.

    • Biggay [he/him, comrade/them]@hexbear.net
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      20 days ago

      I agree. I think the main type of people who think Trump is worse than Biden/Kamala just dont want to see the huge power of imperialism focused back in on itself. Theyre a kind of racist chauvinist that doesnt value the lives of brown people anywhere else unless they are here.

    • UmbraVivi [he/him, she/her]@hexbear.net
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      20 days ago

      I don’t think either Kamala or Trump believe in much of anything but I do think the Republicans are straight-up cartoon villains and more evil than the Dems. Not because the Dems are good, they’re horrible, the Republicans are just that comically vile.

      • I do believe the republicans are more evil, but I also think they’re a less competent evil that by being so comical provokes a lot of pushback.

        The Republicans aim to do 100% evil and only manage to do 75%, the Democrats aim for 90% evil and succeed.

    • YEP [he/him]@hexbear.net
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      20 days ago

      In the comparing of candidates. I feel like it not that deep. Like there is something very viscerally repellent about the manifestation of Cristo fascism on the American right.

      Like I think of the liberal canard of 99% Hitler retoric and like my rejection of it is on the basis that I wont vote for any% Hitler rather than the premise that they are equal. Idk maybe this is a vestige of my liberalism.

    • QueerCommie [she/her, fae/faer]@hexbear.net
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      20 days ago

      As a youth who realized I’m mostly so based (and scarcely compared to her) because this area is my autistic special interest, I’m afraid we’re in a similar boat as non-representatives. Still, I remain hopeful and we are slowly radicalizing as conditions worsen.

      • Imnecomrade [none/use name]@hexbear.net
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        20 days ago

        I have noticed that many people who are disabled (such as myself who is AuDHD) or GSM/trans are usually the first to be radicalized as MLs (or at least anarchists).

        • Cowbee [he/him, they/them]@hexbear.net
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          20 days ago

          Just as proletarians are more likely to support leftist ideas, so too are other oppressed groups of people. It’s a matter of survival, the system is actively hostile towards people who aren’t cishet male cracker

          It’s also why intersectional theory is so important.

        • QueerCommie [she/her, fae/faer]@hexbear.net
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          20 days ago

          Maybe it’s just my manner of talking but I have radicalized in part a decent amount of people - all ADHD and/or autistic. I have also met other leftists that are almost all neurodivergent. I feel like the strong interests, neuroatypical empathy, and feelings of justice play a role beyond the explanation of oppression/disability.

          • Imnecomrade [none/use name]@hexbear.net
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            20 days ago

            I definitely believe the deep empathy that neurodivergents are usually better at plays a key role, along with the obsessive interests and experience of oppression/discrimination. Most autistic people struggle with keeping a job for two years, so the financial and time management struggle I believe pushes us to the left quickly.

          • REgon [they/them]@hexbear.net
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            20 days ago

            I get told I have a strong “sense of right and wrong” due to my ADHD and I don’t really feel like that’s related. I feel like I might just notice things more because I diverge in some ways, so I notice wrongs. Having wrong done upon oneself then makes one more empathetic to fighting wrongs in general. Also depressed. But ey, whatyagonnado eh

    • Moss [they/them]@hexbear.net
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      20 days ago

      I’m the same age as Greta, and she was a massive inspiration to me when she started. I was a communist first but she has done massive amounts of good, getting young people invested in climate change action, and also seeing how useless liberal protest is

  • NoLeftLeftWhereILive@hexbear.net
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    20 days ago

    Waiting for the inevitable “Greta is a Russian assett” think piece.

    Or in a more infantilizing way “Has been influenced by Russian propaganda”

  • a_little_red_rat [he/him, comrade/them]@hexbear.netM
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    20 days ago

    I live in sweden and the divide on Greta is hilarious. On one hand you have reactionaries who STILL put stickers like “fuck you greta!” on their shitty cars, on the other you have lib climate activists who seem downright scared of her more based activism and talk about her “having gone too far” in hushed voices. Only ppl I’ve met that like her now are either MLs or hardcore anarchists. Imagine if she would join a marxist org

        • Frank [he/him, he/him]@hexbear.net
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          20 days ago

          Idk if it ever aired outside the US but back in the 90s there was a kids show called Captain Planet and these five woke dei kids were like ring wraiths for Gaia and they’d like set oil executives and loggers on fire and if things got too tough they’d combine their ring powers to summer Captain Planet, a cheerful blue murder himbo who would use super powers to do eco-terrorism. This was a show for children! One regular ass tv! It could never happen today. Never. It wouldn’t be tolerated.

          • a_little_red_rat [he/him, comrade/them]@hexbear.netM
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            20 days ago

            Oh, I’ve seen it too. Many shows back then had eco activism as a good thing, or at least oil execs as villains. I think even that weird “Motormice from Mars” show had an oil baron as the main antagonist.

            And I don’t think it couldn’t happen now. Media, even when revolutionary on the surface, is barely driving real world engagement and can be easily defanged. We live in the revival era of anti-capitalist messaging in media (film and even video games), and yet it’s been fully consumed by capital. I hate Zizek and his clique, but Mark Fisher was spot on in Capitalist Realism.

            Avatar, one of the biggest box office successes in the world, has a blatant anti-colonial message yet most people don’t apply it to the obvious parallells in the rral world. We just consume, feel good for a moment for agreeing with the obvious morally correct choice, then do fuck all about it. And execs know it.

            sorry for the doomer note here

            • FortifiedAttack [any]@hexbear.net
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              20 days ago

              yet most people don’t apply it to the obvious parallells in the real world

              Because they think they don’t live in that world. They can’t see the parallels because they see their world as flawless.

              They think it’s all fictional and made-up, and that, because they are receiving their treats, they must therefore live in a utopia.

          • REgon [they/them]@hexbear.net
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            19 days ago

            It did come out of a time period when urban guerrillas had just stopped being active. Plane hijackings were still pretty normal. In the context of its’ time it was super chill, these days it’s no longer chill. Overton window and all that I guess.

      • REgon [they/them]@hexbear.net
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        19 days ago

        Well you see it’s actually words and ideas that change the world <- Liberal ideology

        Which is why we should let nazis say whatever they want, to demonstrate the strength of the concept of freedom of speech <- Also liberal ideology

        But leftists need to shut the fuck up <- Still liberal ideology

      • a_little_red_rat [he/him, comrade/them]@hexbear.netM
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        20 days ago

        I am all about kill your heroes etc, so I don’t follow her and only hear about her every few months, and while I am always positively surprised, she wouldn’t be the first to take a nose dive at a moment’s notice. At the same time, I don’t think she’s actually trying to sell out, her shit is extremely unsellable ever since she dropped the lib “school strike” and went in with more hardcore activism. I think she might be genuine, and I say that as somebody who thought she was just a preppy kid back during her strike years (she comes from a well-off family etc).

  • Utter_Karate [he/him, comrade/them]@hexbear.net
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    20 days ago

    Shit, Hexbear is old. I remember people here discussing how we shouldn’t be too critical of her because she was still a child. Now she’s a young woman and we still shouldn’t be too critical of her because she’s right. I hope the rest of the generation tries to emulate it.