You’re still babying a car.
What if you could, like, delegate the entire driving process to someone? It sounds outlandish to pay for a driver, so what if you and a lot of others got together to take one vehicle. Perhaps some specialised vehicle where, through an economy of scale, it makes sense for hundreds to be moved by one driver. And for this economy of scale, what if you get the vehicle to go to places that makes sense for many of you at once.
It would make no sense for such a vehicle to be one rigid vehicle, so what if you instead make a chain of vehicles? Guidance of… let’s just call it an articulated hypercar… would be challenging, so what if you build a road for it, where you could build the guidance into it. Since the path is now very predictable, you could even optimise the interface between your vehicle and the path for rolling resistance and speed, and build an electricity supply directly in your hyperway.
I just invented a train, didn’t I?
hey, i didn’t know adam something was on lemmy
No I’m not, but I’ll take this allegation as a compliment
Ha, by the end of the paragraph I was reading it entirely in his voice.
I heard his voice starting at “economies of scale”. If you get past “articulated hypercar” then you must have never seen one of his videos.
Haha I read your top comment in his voice and it 100% works
Adam Something, dat you?
He’s missing the world of tanks ad read half way through
If you’re driving a train its the same as if you’re flying a plane. You’re still responsible for the vehicle for the whole journey. If something goes wrong, you’re expected to respond immediately and deal with the issue.
This is different from what a user expects of an autonomous car. We expect the car to handle and take responsibility of all of that, such that the driver is nothing but a passenger.
Even when automation reaches that level, the big issue will always be insurance. Even if autonomous vehicles have less accidents, that will only mean less revenue for insurance companies. And that’s assuming they can pin liability onto the customer, rather than the manufacturer.
Between driving a train or everyone driving cars, there’s a subtle difference between expecting everyone to do so individually or expecting a few to do so professionally.
I would not trust autonomous cars for the coming while. If Tesla cannot make autonomous cars work in a tunnel, built entirely for Tesla cars, used only by Tesla cars, then I doubt that within my lifetime, we’ll see autonomous cars become good enough for the general public. And even if they do, they’re one computer bug or cyberattack away from a motorway pile-up. And you can bet your ass that a driver in an autonomous car will doze off when he’s got the chance, so you cannot trust everyone to drive a self driving car.
Besides, autonomous cars still have almost every other problem as regular cars. You still have two tons of steel, glass & plastic for one person to move around, supported on rubber tyres on asphalt, which is noisy, energy-inefficient and an absolute space hog. Now it’s not the owner calling the shots as to where & how the vehicle is going, but a black box.
Imagine if trains were nice in the US. Riding Amtrack feels like riding in a 20 year old Pepsi can
Even in a place like Warsaw, Poland the trains are better even though it was completely leveled during World War 2, then under an Communist government that proceeded to nuke the economy for the next 60 years, and still has better trains.
Trains are generally a lot cheaper then the price of fuel for a car, nice and comfortable, and actually on time.
@nothacking @_finger_ Same deal for your cousins over the border in Lithuania.
Here’s some extra details, so our American friends can compare the train services in a less wealthy EU country to Amtrak. (Keep in mind this is nowhere near the level of service you’ll find in countries such as France or Germany.)
You can get a second class ticket on a modern LTGLink train from Vilnius to Kaunas for just €8. That gets you:
“Electrical outlets near some seats, space for bicycles, [on-board toilets], animal-friendly area, air conditioning, non-smoking area. Possibility to buy soft drinks and snacks on Kaunas and Klaipeda routes. When buying a ticket on the Klaipeda route, it is possible to choose a place and seating direction.”
Or in first class (just €11.10 for Vilnius to Kaunas, roughly equivalent to US$12.17) you get this:
“Passengers have free coffee, soft drinks, and snacks. More spacious seating, wider tables, electrical sockets at the seats, fewer seats and passengers around, choice of seat and seat when buying a ticket, space for bicycles, [on-board toilets], air conditioning, silence area, luggage area, non-smoking area.”
Here’s the on-board menu: https://ltglink.lt/en/menu-on-vilnius-klaipeda-vilnius-route
Yes, you can order a hot or cold sandwich, a cappuccino, Belgian waffles, noodles, donuts, Oreos, chips, a Snickers bar, or whatever other snack you want. The train staff bring it to your seat.
The seats are comfortable, like a first-class plane seat but with more leg room. You can use free wi-fi, and charge your phone at your seat.
Services on the Vilnius–Kaunas line run roughly every hour from 4:55am to 9:25pm, and more frequently during peak times during the day.
There’s a train station at Vilnius airport. Just about every trolleybus and bus in Vilnius runs to the main train station, stopping just metres from the front door, and there’s also a coach terminal connecting to smaller towns and villages.
So you can catch a trolleybus from the national Parliament building, a coach from a small village, or a train from the airport, then easily transfer at the main train station to an intercity service to Kaunas or Klaipeda.
And I’d like to remind you that Lithuania’s train system is considered *bad* by European standards.
Damn. Getting food brought to you anywhere on the train sounds dope! I’m Swiss and even we don’t have that.
I think a good comparison is, it’s like a plane, but without any of the problems: no security, more legroom, better food, less noise, no long layovers, and at a lower price.
As to prices, Warsaw Kraków (150 mi, 250km) first class on PKP will cost 20 USD or 18 GBP, with a train every hour, and will get there in 2h 40m, but a car will take 3h 30m.
Whoa, soup in a bottle. I don’t think I’ve really seem that in the US. Sounds like a good idea!
though it was completely leveled
So were a lot of American cities… The only difference: it was self inflicted - to make room for cars.
I’ll miss my 50k + 0.5k a month of various insurance/fees/repairs so much
Hands down the best mode of transport to lose money
I found the person whose never owned a yacht.
Pff, you dont lose money on a yacht. You use it for tax fraud so.in a sense it actually makes you money.
But is a yacht really a mode of transportation?
Or even a plane. Let someone else monitor the autopilot for you.
Do you one better: Not only did I not have to monitor traffic, I fall asleep regularly on the train and some of the nicer busses in my city.
Well not technically fully fell asleep, more lkle went into that half asleep state where you’re still conscious enough to usually not miss your stop. Still somehow end up feeling somewhat rested afterwards so I’ll take it.
Low power mode xD
They are soooo close!
yeah we’re only getting more highways here in Ontario no trains
Maybe new Toronto mayor will fix it? Or move to Vancouver I guess…
I don’t think that’ll make a difference. I think Canada is the only G7 country without any high speed rail?
Bold of you to call Acela HSR
Not at all. I almost always have a couple beers when I take the train.
Nice. How did they respond?
That should say comma.ai and the Comma3 device. Dunno why the link doesn’t show.
?
Except when you get where you’re going you don’t have to take another bus or rely on somebody to shuttle you around. And have you ever been on a long haul greyhound? By all accounts it’s a pretty garbage experience.
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All you need to do, is always use the best option. Not be one of those people who drives everywhere, even when its in walking distance, or easily accessed by public transit.
If your city doesn’t have those options, voting for them, is what you’re supposed to do. Don’t be one of those people who run cyclists off the road, or go apeshit when a lane is taken away somewhere, in order to add one for bikes.
No-one is riding a bike 3 hours anywhere, except for sport. But we shouldn’t drive for 30 minutes if a slight alteration in infrastructure would allow getting there in 15 minutes on a bike.
Integrated transport. Bike+bus or train or whatever.
The problem isn’t cars. The problem is land use deliberately designed to make anything that’s not a car non-viable.
Imagine if you will urban planning that doesn’t surround every business with a concrete moat and every pancaked home with a football field of yard that most will rarely ever use. Planning that doesn’t segregate every building function into distinct zones and make each zone as large as possible so you have no choice but to travel long distances for EVERYTHING.
While yes I agree a bus or a train is a better option than having shit ton of self driving robo cars something about having your own space and being able to set the temperature to what you want and play your music on the speakers is nice for some people
It’s not like we’re about getting rid of cars altogether. It just shouldn’t be both the default and only option. They’re a luxury item, not the bare minimum required, lest you be destined for poverty.
Nobody actually thinks we want to obliterate cars, they just need to echo the assertion that we do to assure themselves they made the right decision in taking on bloated payments for a 6 wheel yeeyee truck to drive from their apartment to their desk job.
6 wheel yeeyee truck to drive from their apartment to their desk job
Given the excitement around SUVs I wouldn’t be surprised if this is a reality in the near future lol
It already is, I personally know people who are this person 😂
I’m not saying that you are either I’m just saying that it’s not bad to like luxury items like cars and that there are some benefits for those who can afford them
i enjoy when people bring this up as if to imply that that’s a good reason to keep building american car-centric suburbia
Sounds to me like an excuse to invest in making the experience quality of transit better, at least for some. Longer distances in Executive Class aboard the Frecciarossa looks & sounds like a travelling experience that even the most determined car dependency fan would leave his car home for.
you’ll never hear me say no to better trains. a healthy society isn’t where the poor drive, but where the rich listen to duke ellington, or however the saying goes.
Not my point was just staying liking a car isn’t a bad thing and is valid being dependent on cars and them being our only option is stupid though
i’m glad you agree on car dependency being bad. the problem is that you were arguing for cars being useful for some people for some small reasons as if you were responding to an argument that we should ban all cars everywhere all the time. so if you don’t mind, i’d like to walk you through why your comment went… unappreciated here, despite no ill intention on your part.
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that’s not what the post was arguing
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that’s not what anybody in fuckcars argues
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basically everbody in fuckcars, including me, will agree with the statement that cars have legitimate use cases, so arguing it as if you will meet any pushback is sus
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arguing that point based on temperature control and music on speakers implies that the objections people of fuckcars have to car dependency are similarly centered around one’s own immediate personal comfort, rather than long-term societal health which directly and indirectly benefits everybody in that society, even those who can’t afford a car with working speakers or a/c in our current version of society
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these sorts of implications are very commonly done intentionally by people arguing disingenuously, many of whom i’ve run into on either this forum or the reddit precursor
do ya see where i’m coming from now?
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The music thing can easily be fixed by headphones rhe temperature usually works out for me but i guess that’s personal preference
You can usually handle the temperature easily with sensible clothing choices.
Do you guys not have AC in your trains?
Yes but I don’t have control over it.
Yeah but speakers are often nicer to listen to than headphones not saying it’s needed just a nice luxury it’s like having your own house vs having roommates
That says more to me about the quality of headphones, and therefore more about you than about cars or transit.
What do you want me to have 1000 dollar open back headphones so that everyone on the train can hear everything I’m listening to
You don’t need 1000 dollar ones, just spend more than 10$ on a non dollar store pair.
While not cheap, headphones with active noise cancelling is much better for public transport imo. E.g. the Sony WH-1000XM4 would set you back $350, which is a bit, but probably much cheaper than a car
Yeah but speakers are often nicer to listen to than headphones
Most audiophiles would vehemently disagree!
It is also nice to be able to leave when you want, and get off the road to take a break or stop to eat where you want. It is also nice to have the flexibility to move around as you please at your destination.
I really wish that the US had a functional rail system, let along high speed rail. I fell in love with sleeper trains when I was living abroad in college, it was so nice to get dinner somewhere near the centrally located train station, hop on the train, hang out a bit then get rocked to sleep and wake up at your destination.
Fuck using a car to commute, I am more than happy to take the train for that, and generally when transit is convenient I prefer to not have to drive.
I feel the ability to blast your own music is a weird consolation prize for having to drive.
I’ve listened to music on public transport for years and the difference between headphones and car speakers does not compensate for the difference between driving and riding.
Get this: if you spend less time in the car, you get more time to do that at time!
That’s called staying home.
No one’s stoping you from putting on headphones.
So you live at the combined bus/train station and work at another bus/train station with a direct link - that’s cool.
If you live an 8 hour drive away from your job I think that’s a bigger problem than focusing on the lack of last mile transportation in the US 😳
The problem with the US is that everything is so large. So instead of optimising for space and transport like Europe did, historically our cities started as ports, and towns were individual ranches. When that became more developed, the towns were too close together to justify building full services, businesses, transportation, etc, into all of them. But now because of that, we developed everything around 60+ mile commutes, etc, so everyone outside of the cities needs a car, and there’s too many of the ‘micro-cities’ spaced miles apart to build trains. Too close to justify trains, but too far to walk or cycle. The only thing that might work is buses, but even then the routes would be so convoluted that it’s been hard to implement at least in my region (believe me, we try)… Everything is so stupidly spaced out that trips that really should be on foot like in Europe require a car here…
I genuinely do, actually.
I live quite near an intersection with bus stops, tram stops, AND underground metro train stops. (Sörnäinen, Helsinki)
My work is in (Pasila, Helsinki) which has literally an intercity train station, and also tram stops and bus stops.
That’s nice. I used to live within a 4km bike ride to a train station where I could get off the train and walk 200m to my job - those were great days. I miss trains.
When I started my current job I was I switched to cars because of this. While my home town was great in terms of PT and I had a bus stop next to the house, where I worked I would have had to walk 20 minutes - about as long as my complete car commute.
Then last summer I re-ran the numbers taking into account the advent of e-scooters. I could now get to work about as fast as by car but so much more comfortable. I absolutely loved it and reignited my love for PT.
I do a 20 minute walk from the bus stop to work everyday, it’s truly not as bad as it seems. It sucks on hot days but dress light and even an umbrella and you can make it work.
Found the person that never left the suburban house they paid 2000000$ for in the middle of nowhere. With reasonable high density housing it is absolutely possible to live within walking distance of a bus or even subway stop.
It never happened to me. Right now I have to get up to take my wife 2km to the stop where the KCE bus drives past to take her to work… and there is quite a lot of high density housing where I live, but most of it is not along main roads with access to transport.
Not everyone lives along the subway/train/bus routes. The solution would obviously be more large multistorey car-parks for park and ride, but I know of only 3 locations around Bangkok that have that.
