This is a common statement by those who haven’t read theory, especially among the Western Left, but this isn’t true in any capacity. Billionaires are regularly executed in the PRC, the fact that the PRC has a private sector doesn’t mean it has shifted away from Marxism-Leninism. The entire reason Marx predicted Socialism, ie Public Ownership and Central Planning, to overtake Capitalism is because markets naturally prepare the foundations for Socialism. Competition forces more and more companies to consolidate and grow, develop their own infrastructure for planning, which can be siezed and used by the public.

Question 17 : Will it be possible to abolish private property at one stroke?

Answer : No, no more than the existing productive forces can at one stroke be multiplied to the extent necessary for the creation of a communal society. Hence, the proletarian revolution, which in all probability is approaching, will be able gradually to transform existing society and abolish private property only when the necessary means of production have been created in sufficient quantity.

-Engels, The Principles of Communism

Half the economy of the PRC is in the Public Sector, and another almost tenth is in the cooperative sector. The Private Sector covers mostly light industry that depends on Publicly Owned industries like steel and public infrastructure. As Capital consolidates in the Markets, the CPC increases ownership. I recommend reading Socialism Developed China, Not Capitalism. Markets are more efficient at lower levels of development, and Public Ownership and Planning is more efficient at higher levels of development.

If you want to learn more about Marxism, I made an introductory Marxist reading list.

There’s a lot of gish-gallop here but I’ll respond to a good deal of it.

Um, hello by definition a monarchy is not democracy so blaming one for rampant corporate imperialism doesn’t really work for your meme.

The UK has a parliamentary system and practices liberal democracy. Churchill was directly responsible for millions starving in India.

US expansion into native American lands was definatly greed for sure, but hardly a feature of a democracy

This meme is not anti-democratic. It’s against the usage of “democracy” as a justification for Imperialist intervention and slaughter.

but I wonder how you miss Romans and greeks out

We don’t. This meme is again, targeting the US and EU’s usage of “spreading democracy” as justification for wanton slaughter.

Serious question though, where are you getting millions of Iraqis From?

The consequences of the US thoroughly obliterating nearly all infrastructure in Iraq led to countless deaths. It’s the same process as what’s happening in Palestine right now.

Korea and Vietnam, yes i agree imperialistic expansionism but that’s true for both the ussr + china. Countries have long been trying to influence and take over others. It all fucking sucks, yes. But to say it’s all just democratic imperialism? That’s just pure nonsense and complete misunderstanding of just how shit most humans in places of power are. Look at what happened in USSR, it has so little to do with actual communism it’s a fetal position rolling on the floor crying coping mechanism.

Can you explain how the USSR and PRC are Imperialist? Do/did they export Capital to the Global South to hyper-exploit for super-profits domestically?

Secondly, can you explain how the USSR was not Communist? They had a publicly owned, planned economy, your only justification that this isn’t true is an attack on Marxists.

By the way, I am saying both sides, yes because both are guilty in the net effect of human suffering. Should one of the sides roll over and surrender? Well no, in my mind neither side should have escalated to an armed conflict in the first place.

So the USSR should not have assisted the Cuban revolutionaries overthrowing the fascists, the Palestinian resistance against genocide, the Algerian revolutionaries, and so forth? This is nonsense. Liberatory movements are in no way “equally bad” as Imperialist aggression.

Some people have this amazing feature of a working brain, mouth and ears so we can think, talk and listen and resolve our conflicts instead of looking at the neighbours and going “yep that be better to be mine”.

Let me know when you can talk to a billionaire and convince them to overthrow Capitalism in the US or EU.

What I am saying here is yes corporate democracy sucks, but saying it’s the only pure root of evil is clearly overreaching.

Nobody said that, though. You are pretending that’s the point of the meme for debatelordism, despite that not being the purpose of the meme at all.

If you want to learn more about Marxism, I made an introductory Marxist reading list, which includes history books regarding Marxist states and liberatory movements.

Yep. Rainbow Imperialism and all that. Weaponizing treating marginalized groups slightly less bad and just watching with glee when the slightly worse group does what it does. Liberals don’t actually care about marginalized people, which is why they shift from advocacy to sadism so easily.

You probably need to count a wee bit better yourself. Millions more died in the Tsarist regime and agrarian China under the Nationalist Kuomintang. The US slaughtered countless millions of indigenous Americans, Koreans, Vietnamese, Iraqis, and numerous other small nations, as well as enslaved millions. The UK in particular has slaughtered millions of Indians. To this day, both the US and EU hyper-exploit the Global South and extract vast amounts of rent, resources, and profits off the back of workers in the Global South.

China hasn’t been at war for 40 years and the USSR was disbanded in 1991, meanwhile the US and EU continue their plunder. Even during the time of the USSR, they fought for the liberation of peoples against Empire and Colonialism, hence their support for groups like the Popular Front for the Liberation of Palestine, Cuba, Algeria, and so forth.

This is “both sides-ism” that refuses to look at which side was doing what, and for which interests.

I suggest you read Blackshirts and Reds.

The never-ending justification for the ratchet-effect.

Reading theory helps me contextualize and analyze the world around us, which gives hope for a successful future for Humanity. I even wrote an introductory Marxist reading list to help anyone else who wants to start reading Leftist theory.

In addition to that, I find comfort with my friends and family, reading, cooking, gaming, and otherwise engaging with my hobbies.

Who is downvoting this? The US and EU have slaughtered millions in support of Imperialism veiled as “liberation” and “establishing democracy,” even the more liberal sections of Lemmy seem to grasp that. Is it the inclusion of the EU as guilty, and not just the US?

Should be included, but the fact that the Soviet Union was established and many more Socialist States and liberatory movements around the world have successfully applied Lenin’s analysis and tools to their own conditions speaks to its practicality. Einstein made a good case for Socialism in Why Socialism? but falls into the same trap many Western leftists do in denying actual leftist movements as “legitimate.” Einstein is speaking against himself here, in admiring Lenin’s devotion to social justice and referring to him as a genuine “guardian and restorer of humanity,” surely he can see that the practical results of that devotion are a consequence of Lenin’s methods?

It would certainly be good for the working class if Bernie took a more militant stance, but that hasn’t been his game. He has postured his whole life as a radical that works within the system, not against it, which is why his victories have been relatively few compared to what they could have been. It’s up to us to build a working class movement. I have an introductory Marxist reading list if you want to check something out, but the short answer is that workers need to organize, and Bernie won’t advocate for something that goes against the present system.

I look forward to watching y’all eat crow as Israel wipes out Palestine

Wow, the liberals are straight up admitting their monstrous racism now?

the US leaves NATO

This would be good for the Global South, which is why Trump won’t do it

and western democracy collapses.

The West hasn’t had a workable implementation of Democracy to begin with, though if you finally recognize that are you going to sit out or do something about it?

Oil is only one factor, what matters is the country’s stance towards US Imperialist interests and how they work for or against those interests.

Thanks, comrade 🫡

Oh hey! Yep, this is the list I made. It also has audiobooks! Thanks for the shoutout, comrade 🫡

🦀

So Trots are the “true leftists” in your opinion? So true and pure they haven’t successfully had a single revolution, so they are untainted by reality?

Yep, that’s a great article I love sharing.

What are these “right-wing principles” non-Trot Communists have an affinity for?

What do you mean “too Communist?”

Some of the questlines were fun, like the Pirate Double Agent questline.

You’re on Lemmy.ml, which is admin’d and moderated by Communists, and Lemmy itself is made by Communists. It isn’t a hive mind.