A Ukrainian Neo-Nazi soldier visited the Auschwitz death camp wearing a shirt quoting Hitler in order to mock the camp’s victims. This is the type of truly fascist scum that billions and billions of US taxpayer dollars are going to fund and arm.
So let me get this straight: if I don’t want to ethnically cleanse Palestinians I’m an anti-semite. But if I wear a camp auschwitz t-shirt while doing the roman salute, NATO will send me billions of dollars?
Pretty much.
Who wants to take on for the team? Wear a Nazi shirt to Auschwitz, take the billions of dollars of weapons, then immediately turn them over to Palestine? I hear Gaza could use some Patriot missiles and Javelins.
It’s already happening. Arms meant for Ukraine end up in the hands of resistance fighters. Obviously corrupt Ukranians are selling the stuff they get to the black market.
This would be cool if true, got any sources to back this up?
I don’t think that’s been confirmed to be happening.
Russia gives weapons captured from AFU to Donbas militia, but idk if that person meant this.
I think they meant weapons from Ukraine ending up in Palestine, which hasn’t been proven AFAIK.
Some most likely did, but in hands of mecenaries Ukraine send there to fight for Is*ael. Otherwise never heard of it, but i would bet black market is full of it and especially after AFU ultimate rout there will be weapons from Ukraine everywhere.
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were they also shooting in the right direction when they were attempting to ethnically cleanse ukraine of uh… ukrainians?
No. In fact I don’t have any respect nor any sympathy for them. That said, today I rather have then dying to push back the invasion than Ukrainian civilians forced to join the army.
In either case, it’s not like weapons are given to them to let them do what they would do if they were completely free (thankfully), so OP argument seems invalid to me. It’s a disgrace that the West is not only not defending Palestine, but aiding Israel, but this doesn’t make it automatically wrong to arm Ukrainians. It’s not like they are not sending weapons to Gaza because they finished to send them to Ukraine.
incidentally, since you know so much about this, if the nazis are such a small irrelevant minority in ukraine’s govt (and they’re definitely not in power), why is it so hard to get pictures of ukrainian soldiers without nazi tattoos and nazi patches?
oh, and why is the government full of people like this? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Andriy_Melnyk_(diplomat)
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i like your coy avoidance. dude’s an open banderite. that’s a nazi. that’s what i mean when i say people like him.
so anyway, why did zelensky’s totally not a nazi government pick a blatant nazi to be one of their ambassadors? why was he not fired and buried in a pit when he displayed his naziness to the whole world? why was he just recalled and sent to another country to continue to be a nazi ambassador?
this doesnt sound like a country that’s on top of it’s supposedly tiny nazi minority. a country that lets them shell the donbass for years, seemingly unable or unwilling to stop them. a country that seems to always picks nazis (tattoos, patches) for its army PR pictures.
oh, and there’s this also to prove how tiny the nazi minority is in ukraine: 31% of them approve of bandera. 76% percent of those who live in western Ukraine have a positive opinion towards Bandera (https://www.kyivpost.com/post/7138).
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but Nazi parties are still a super tiny minority (like Right Sector) and so are the Nazi battalions who got incorporated into the army
lol, peak liberal brain. These heavily-armed Nazi groups are incorporated into the army and people don’t vooooooooooot for them, surely they have no power.
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It’s hard to get pictures of Ukrainian army without Nazi symbols? What…?
Perhaps they mean things like
This
or this
or this
or this
or this
or maybe this
That Nazi minority seems to end up in front of Western news cameras a lot. Weird since those new agencies have an incentive to downplay the presence of far right elements in the Ukrainian military. It’s almost like they’re so embedded in their forces that war corespondents can’t help but pick up a few dudes with SS tattoos
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Just wanna say I skimmed it and that essay sucks ass, Jacobin has about a 90 percent miss rate on foreign affairs
Interesting, why do you say that? I find it culturally distant, but I think very good points were made.
No mention of the discrimination and shelling of civilians in the east by Ukrainian government. No mention of NATO aggression since the 90s against Russia. Serious usage of the word “authoritarian” as if this is a genuine political description. Stating that the west did not want this war (?? Wtf). Dismissing off hand in the first part the very real critiqures of Ukraine and NATO as Russian propaganda. The whole thing stinks of radliberalism.
He tries to position zelensky as a poor guy just caught between evil Russians and evil Nazis. Total bullshit. The only grain of truth is that yes, Nazis have many weapons and manpower in Ukraine. So why did Zelensky elevate them during those grand tours all around the world begging for international Patreon subscribers? These Nazis need to be liquidated, not appeased, and if Ukraine and the west is not up to the task (and why would they be? These Nazis are the only committed fighters they can throw against Russians) then Russia is going to do it. I say that as someone who does not like Putin, but as someone who can see the way that war is going.
This guy, even if he is genuine in being a “socialist” whatever he thinks that means, does not have the correct context to understand even his own involvement in this war. He comes off as basically a liberal in all his justifications but then puts a little red fig leaf over these wrong justifications by claiming to be a “leftist”.
What’s funny is that he mentions a “Ukrainian resistance”. I’m sure this was written in the heady days of all those “Putler is finished!” and sanction flinging. Looking back from 2024, there is no resistance and never was. Ukrainians who could rightfully got the fuck out of the country, why would they stay to die for a government that never gave them shit?
And this part I have to laugh at, it shows how out of date even two years later this piece is.
Any Russian success would strengthen Vladimir Putin’s regime and its reactionary tendencies. It would not mean peace, but decades of instability, guerrilla resistance in the occupied territories, and recurrent clashes on the demarcation line. It would be a disaster not only for Ukraine but also for Russia, where a reactionary political drift would intensify and the economy would suffer from sanctions, with severe consequences for ordinary civilians.
It’s true that there would be a guerilla war if Russia occupied ethnically Ukrainian parts of Ukraine. Especially if these Nazi groups are allowed to exist. And as of July 2024, that’s not what they’re doing. Second, I just have to laugh at the part mentioning sanctions, it just brings back quaint memories. The fact is, the Russian economy has neutered the threat of sanctions and is orienting itself eastward to the detriment of Europe. No more cheap energy for German factories. But don’t worry, uncle Sam is there to help…
As for the idea of a Ukrainian resistance mentioned there. I live in a place that recieved quite a few Ukrainians and work with a handful. To paraphrase what they’ve all said to me: “the country was fucked before 2022, with all the corruption and attending ills that come with kowtoing to the neoliberal/western order. We’re not gonna die for that, and we’re never going back.” So between the attitudes of the diaspora, and the fact that the only way for the Ukrainian army to replenish it’s manpower is by snatching people with trucks, I have to just laugh at the idea of a Ukrainian resistance that isn’t led by neo Nazis.
Last, it’s odd that there’s an argument put forward that , because America losing in Vietnam was a good thing, that Russia should lose the Ukraine war to push back their world domination. As if the world hegemon in the 60s-70s is comparable to Russia’s regional role today. I mean if we’re being honest we can skip the mental gymnastics and say that Ukraine should lose the war, because then America will lose by proxy and that’s a good thing according to the author. They’re still the most important node in global capitalism today after all. The point he tries to make isn’t a flattering one for his own argument, and once again shows how he doesn’t understand historical context of these events. Instead he seems to have an essentially liberal lens of “small guy good, big guy bad”.
No wonder Jacobin published that article . It ticks off all their little boxes of being pathetically aesthetically radical without actually coming to a different conclusion than that reached by the US state department.
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Yes, because the weapons are sent directly to these guys so that they can use it to exterminate Jews
That’s exactly what’s happening.
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Are Jews being exterminated in Ukraine?
Also weapons are not sent directly to battalions (incl. Nazi ones) AFAIK, they are sent to the general command who distributes them.
It’s been confirmed (by Western news sources) that many of the weapons sent to Ukraine aren’t accounted for at all, so there’s no way to know where exactly they end up.
I also have to dispute your point that they’re not being sent directly to battalions, since the US recently lifted the ban on supplying the Azov Battalion.
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So you are implying that Nazis might start Jew extermination at some point.
Do you even look back at what you write before you post it?
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which I think implies it’s currently happening.
It really doesn’t. If I say ”I’m going to buy some groceries to make dinner”, there’s no implication that I’m going to start making dinner immediately.
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Ukrainian Nazis seem more focused on ethnic Russians and Roma than Jews (at the moment) probably because they’re allied with the West and being too blatantly anti-Semitic could cost them NATO bucks. There’s been plenty of reporting on their attacks against Russians and Roma though.
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Couldn’t be more blatant NATO loser
Lol you literally can’t imagine a non-russian person disagreeing with you about supporting nazis, absolutely brainrotted
Slobber Ukrainski
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∞ 🏳️⚧️Edie [it/its, she/her, fae/faer, love/loves, ze/hir, des/pair, none/use name, undecided]@hexbear.netEnglish231·2 months agoThis place aint for you lemm.ee user.
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Now, anything you care to say about the actual discussion, or you’d rather waste some more bytes and corresponding CO2 emissions on personal meaningless attacks, first?
Nice emoji. Is there some hidden message or it’s literally just a waste of bytes like this comment?
Maybe this one is more to your liking
I liked even the other one TBH. That said, I don’t feel you are contributing much to the discussion. It’s not mandatory to do so, despite how much I enjoy the fun emojis.
Oh I see. Not sure there is much point in discussing that you don’t want to discuss…
You can’t logic someone out of a position they didn’t logic themselves into unfortunately.
Could you “logic” your way around this image please?
What’s the logic of attempting to ethically cleanse millions of Russian speaking Ukrainians while arming and incorporating dozens of neo-nazis militias into the state military while giving them special forces status and pay?
The Azov group has literally been reorganized into one of the major and most well equipped special forces brigades in the Ukrainian army, the same is true for all the premier units with open banderites in charge of the command structure
The only reason you’re feigning ignorance about this is because Ukrainian state and social media isn’t readily observable in the west, so you dipshits can pretend that neo-nazism isn’t the dominant force in Ukrainian cultural and poltical life
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Which is also why it lost a lot of its own identity
It didn’t lose its identity dumbass, it has gain unprecedented power and legitimacy and is now the premier special forces division of the country
Many people left the unit after the incorporation
No they did not, stop making shit up, the command structure of the unit is now made up of Azov prisoners who were captured by the Russians early in the war and released in subsequent prisoner trade exchanges
As I said elsewhere, I also “speak” Russian (can read it decently well) and I generally also read local sources.
lmao you do not speak Russian
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Many died
Many died and then more nazis joined, and the ones who were captured are now leading the unit
Many new units have been created around the country
And they’re all commanded by ideological nazis and banderites leading cohorts of other convinced nazis or demoralized conscripts who don’t want to be there regardless
We are talking of an initial group (2014) that counted 600 members
And then the years 2015, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, and 23 came and went, the concept of time I know it’s wild, now Azov has thousands of fighters and premier government approved status and is simply one of dozens of openly neo-nazi units operating within the Ukrainian military
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An Imgur link was detected in your comment. Here are links to the same location on alternative frontends that protect your privacy.
What definition of imperialism are you using to make this analysis?
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This is an extremely broad definition that has no Marxist basis and would apply to basically any country that trades with another.
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for a place that is supposed to be leftist, there doesn’t seem to be much love for analysis and discussions
There are tons of people discussing and analyzing this with you in this thread, the fact they’re pushing back against your narrative and not immediately validating your dumber talking points doesn’t mean they’re not “open to discussion”, they’re just not open to entertaining you.
I can’t possibly imagine why someone would downvote a comment that answers to a direct question from another user.
This site doesn’t have downvotes so you’re just talking out your ass here.
there is plenty of groupthink trend
We have a somewhat consistent party line here, that’s not groupthink that’s just being clear what our ideological stance is on thing. You can come here and disagree with it but don’t expect a warm welcome, same as I wouldn’t expect a warm welcome if I showed up in a Liberal forum and started dropping hardcore ML talking points.
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You’re not being downvoted, we don’t have downvotes.
Some people are telling you to fuck off yeah, that’s largely cuz you started making Bandera apologia in the thread, which I think is a pretty good “fuck off” line. Besides that you’ve been pretty smug and obtuse this whole thread so I don’t blame people for not wanting to be 100% civil towards you.
Regardless you have been getting people trying to honestly engage you (perhaps not in a totally polite way, nevertheless) so going on some mopey diatribe about what meanie weenies we’ve been to you just comes off as you being whiny.
The locus of nazism is ethnonationalism, racial purity, and eugenics. Killing Jews, communists, socialists, non-chosen peoples and other so called undesirables is downstream of ethnonationalism, not the other way around.
It is not possible for me to tell if you are doing bad faith nazi apologia or if you are just ignorantly doing nazi apologia because of lifelong exposure to anticommunist brainworms. If you are actually good faith about wanting to understand fascism and nazism in ukraine then I encourage you to spend time reading the news comm and various theory about the origins and definition of nazism and fascism.
Regardless, I am temp banning you for the time being because nazi apologism has absolutely no place on this board. If you are willing to learn, demonstrate that willingness with whatever you post in a month.
What pisses me off even more is how common shit like this is at Auschwitz, fucking place is ran like fucking disney world with almost no reverence given to the horrific crimes against humanity beyond a bit of lip service served with a heaping side of zionism
Capitalism will monetize everything it can. I’m just somewhat happy that there is no Auschwitz merch or a subscription service yet.
I have never been, heard they serve food and shit. Is there a gift shop
I don’t think there is a gift shop (it wasn’t when i was there last time at least) nor any other shop in the camp itself, but food shops and the like are nearby since a lot of tourists and school trips going there.
Well that’s good at least
Grindr PFP at Auschwitz
If the USSR was still around they’d put these guys to death, especially since many of the soldiers that liberated the camp were Ukrainian/from Ukraine
“I want USSR to kill Nazis”
Mom: “we have USSR at Home”
USSR at Home:
Gee everyone I think giving these guys weapons might be a bad idea
Gladio 2
@yeahiknow3@lemmy.dbzero.com
How is this spam or abuse? Clown shit
Found the nazi
Always seems to be a dbzero user.
Response to this Nazis post:
Yeah the “Russian narrative” sure does be getting a lot of free food lately.
Also love that’s Libs biggest concern here, that this may aid Russian propaganda.
Death to America
racism against russians has been soo normalized, now even actually nazis doing nazi shit is peal clutched by “leftists”-
They are all over Tennessee also!
If you see a post about a Nazi mocking the victims of Auschwitz and immediately feel like you must defend Ukrainian Nazis now - just get in the damn pit
I wish him an expedient, high velocity, end to his suffering.
More from his Instagram
You want me to take an RT article seriously? 😐
Does the photographic evidence of this hog being a Nazi become fake just because it was posted by RT?
To a lib, unironically yes
Simultaneously not real, and real but not a big deal
But The Guardian, CNN, BBC, MSNBC etc would be fine, right lmao
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This fucking nazi posted this shit on twitter
What part of the story do you think didn’t happen?
Seriously and uncritically, no
As with every single news source, RT is biased. This is normal for humab endeavours, we’re biased by nature
With that being said, there’s a photograph of the man there as well as giving his Instagram handle where you can go see it yourself
I know media literacy is antithetical to liberalism, but come on, try using a single neuron sometime
A smart person can keep in mind the biases of a work while also keeping their own biases in check in order to extract factual information.
silence, liberal
Death to America
midwest.social user
My expectations of you are non-existent.
please explain which part of this post is fake
RT is Russian state propaganda yes, that doesn’t mean literally everything it posts is outright lies. Photos of this guys insta were floating around online before RT posted it, he had a reputation before any official media noticed him.
It’s propaganda yes but sometimes the best propaganda is the truth.
RT is not a source for information. Don’t spread their malicious campaigns.
RT is a source of information that provides news bent with a Russian state agenda, just like the BBC puts out information with a British bent. There is no such thing as an unbiased news source. This news story is essentially a commentary on a news event that clearly happened (neo-nazi mocks Auschwitz victims).
I guess this post drew in all the liberals
we in the Baltics
especially ones who live in neoliberal shitholes full of Nazi monuments
You’re right, one could never trust such biased sources as… the guy’s own fucking instagram account
You can find some nazis in every country. The problem is that kremlin and RT are trying to justify their imperialist and genocidal war as “denazification”. It is total bullshit and you are spreading it by sharing articles like this. If you really care of stopping nazis, look here: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dmitry_Utkin
Wow gee I don’t care, I think every nazi should get turned into giblets of flesh by whatever means necessary.
This war started ten years ago when a US-backed fascist coup overthrew Ukraine’s democratically elected government, for the sole purpose of persecuting the country’s Russian minority. When a chunk of Ukraine’s army defected to fight for the Russian-speaking Urkainian civilians, a low-intensity civil war began. During this time the Ukrainian nazis incessantly bombed the civilian centers of Donetsk and Luhansk, using not only regular munitions, but cluster bombs and white phosphorus.
Russia tried over and over again to solve this problem through diplomacy, because Putin is a cold-blooded, lily-livered coward whose only concern was selling gas to Europe. However, the US continuously sabotaged relations, riling up, funding and arming the nazis to continue their ethnic cleansing campaign. After threatening to let Ukraine join NATO (a promise they privately told Zelensky would never happen) they finally, finally dragged Russia into a hot war - one that Russia first spend a fucking week beforehand recognising the independence of the DPR and LPR, then signing a defence pact with them, and finally starting the SMO in what is possibly one of the most telegraphed invasions of all time.
Russia then continued to conduct the war in the most limited, precisely targeted manner of any war this century, to the extent that the initial push was more like a militarised police action. Instead of obliterating all of Ukraine’s infrastructure, as for instance the US did to Iraq while “liberating” them from their dictator, they targeted only the unmanned electrical substations that powered the train network, preventing Ukrainian troop movement. For the first week, Russia continued sending gas through Ukrainian pipelines, for which they paid the Ukrainian government transit fees, which only stopped because the Ukrainians shut the pipes off.
After easily blowing up a huge amount of Ukrainian materiel and sending an armored column to wait outside Kiev, Russia began negotiating peace. A deal was struck and was about to be signed in April 2022, until Boris Johnson personally visited Kiev (which incidentally, is kind of fucked isn’t it? That he could just jaunt over to the capital of a nation undergoing “a full-scale, genocidal war” without fear? Do you think someone could have visited Saddam Hussein like that?) and promised Zelensky unlimited funding from the West if the war continued, or being totally cut off if they took the peace. Zelensky bowed to his fascist Western handlers, with the result that 600,000 Ukrainians are now dead for no reason as the peace terms back then, as it has come out since, were far more favorable than they’ll be able to get now. The West’s insane hatred for and need to break open and feast on Russia has caused an unfathomable amount of death, and at least part of the blame lies with the “people of NATO” who so readily believe all the obvious lies their governments spew.
Basically, get the language of anti-imperialism out of your fucking mouth you bootlicking NATO fascist.
Ugh, it REEKS of liberalism in here.
Spreading their “malicious campaigns” by doing what? Acknowledging the obvious reality of fascism seeping out of Ukraine
Are you claiming this neo-nazis didn’t go to Auschwitz wearing shirt with a Hilter quote while doubling down on social media?
RT is very good. A lot better than any CIA-controlled news network.