I have a legitimate question. I think I have a hard time understanding the argument that I should not vote for Biden because I am operating under the presupposition that there will inevitably only be one of two outcomes: either Biden or Trump will be president. And within those two outcomes, one is objectively worse than the other. So… Why would I not act to hopefully enable the less bad option from becoming my future?
Both parties are nearly fascist. Both support genocide in Palestine and slaughter at the border. Biden has done more against his supposed promises than for. In the end, I don’t care if you vote. It doesn’t take that long, it won’t matter, and you shouldn’t fret about getting out the vote or something. Energy is best spent outside of electoralism, but you can engage a bit if you want.
At what number of Palestinians does it cross from nearly to fully. I am always wondering but it’s all moot. They would run cover for fascists even if the entire global south was gone. “Look I know we wiped out the bolivians, but the lithium we stole (we could have paid for it btw) allowed us to go green and save humanity”.
And how exactly is it better? Both are puppets of capital and will keep the genocide of the Palestinian people and the war in Ukraine moving. Saying the democrats are better is just pure propaganda. After 4 years of presidency, children are still in cages, anti-trans laws are still being passed, working conditions haven’t improved at all and Guantanamo bay is still operating… I could go on for ages, but I think you get the idea.
we got some train money and the usa is back on the paris accord and they passed the best climate legislation the usa has (to be clear because i know u dont understand the word “best” it is not good nor enough it less bad than everything else), we got some student loan debt relief. a few good things have actually happened that would almost certainly not have happened otherwise.
That will never go to expanding or upgrading our train lines when other countries are already figuring out actual high-speed rail
Paris accord
Funny that you think any corporation in Amerika will actually honor said accords; these people have to be gunned down to make them start caring about the environment because legislature and sanction is not doing it
Student loan debt relief
That only came as a result of debt holders threatening to default en masse and crash the economy again; which led to the most minimal relief Biden could possibly dole out as a spite maneuver. Out of the current 7.4 billion being doled out, AT BEST debt holders can only expect 20k in relief when the vast majority of these debt holders hold way more than that.
The ‘good’ is not enough, and half the time, laced with barbs to catch in one’s throat on the way down after you’ve swallowed it. It’s still death to the Democrats.
if u carefully read my comment u will notice that i only used the word “good” to say something was not good, because it isnt good, non of it is and thats not what was asked the question was how is voting for democrats any better, yes its not good enough that much is self evident, i never said it was, that was never the claim i said it was better. there are 2 options at the federal level neither is good and again i didnt say either was but if u are going to bother to vote one is better.
ur response doesnt even engage with what i said at all, pointing out that the measures are half ass doesnt in any way contradict that they are better than the alternative of literally nothing, pointing out that biden is bad does not exclude the possibility that he is better. it is just mind boggling to me that some people can not understand the meaning of better and lesser it is just so bizarre.
It’s not that we can’t; it’s that we reject this relativist metric in favor of something absolute and quantifiable. Fact: Biden is no better materially for the people or the country. No change he’s put forward in his 3 and a half years of administration has resulted in ANY kind of MATERIAL improvement to the average Amerikan’s living conditions-- and in a lot of places, they’re worse!
After all, he’s responsible for the RICO charging of 61 Black Cop City protestors, he added to Trump’s wall, he’s still running the ‘detention’(read: concentration) camps at the southern border, Roe v Wade went away under his watch, several states have implemented even more draconian anti-abortion and anti-LGBTQ+ legislation under his watch; it goes on and on and on enough that we reject lesser/better comparison where he’s concerned.
He doesn’t deserve the puffery of relativist measurement.
To add to what OP said, the takeaway is that people should be taking politics elsewhere, making propaganda, picketing, whatever (of course, it’s better under a party, which would organize people in order to achieve some goals, but something, anything, is better than nothing). Electoralism didn’t achieve the 8-hour working day.
I have a legitimate question. I think I have a hard time understanding the argument that I should not vote for Biden because I am operating under the presupposition that there will inevitably only be one of two outcomes: either Biden or Trump will be president. And within those two outcomes, one is objectively worse than the other. So… Why would I not act to hopefully enable the less bad option from becoming my future?
Both parties are nearly fascist. Both support genocide in Palestine and slaughter at the border. Biden has done more against his supposed promises than for. In the end, I don’t care if you vote. It doesn’t take that long, it won’t matter, and you shouldn’t fret about getting out the vote or something. Energy is best spent outside of electoralism, but you can engage a bit if you want.
“Nearly” fascist is giving those peckerwoods a LOT more leeway than they deserve
At what number of Palestinians does it cross from nearly to fully. I am always wondering but it’s all moot. They would run cover for fascists even if the entire global south was gone. “Look I know we wiped out the bolivians, but the lithium we stole (we could have paid for it btw) allowed us to go green and save humanity”.
That’s colonialism, not specifically fascism. Liberalism is so bad I don’t know when it ends and fascism begins honestly.
True, the terms signify location and subjects is all, but yes you are correct.
To your question about liberalism and fascism: Aime Cesaire said it best, no difference between a liberal in the colonies and a fascist in Europe.
And how exactly is it better? Both are puppets of capital and will keep the genocide of the Palestinian people and the war in Ukraine moving. Saying the democrats are better is just pure propaganda. After 4 years of presidency, children are still in cages, anti-trans laws are still being passed, working conditions haven’t improved at all and Guantanamo bay is still operating… I could go on for ages, but I think you get the idea.
So, how is voting for Democrats any better?
we got some train money and the usa is back on the paris accord and they passed the best climate legislation the usa has (to be clear because i know u dont understand the word “best” it is not good nor enough it less bad than everything else), we got some student loan debt relief. a few good things have actually happened that would almost certainly not have happened otherwise.
That will never go to expanding or upgrading our train lines when other countries are already figuring out actual high-speed rail
Funny that you think any corporation in Amerika will actually honor said accords; these people have to be gunned down to make them start caring about the environment because legislature and sanction is not doing it
That only came as a result of debt holders threatening to default en masse and crash the economy again; which led to the most minimal relief Biden could possibly dole out as a spite maneuver. Out of the current 7.4 billion being doled out, AT BEST debt holders can only expect 20k in relief when the vast majority of these debt holders hold way more than that.
The ‘good’ is not enough, and half the time, laced with barbs to catch in one’s throat on the way down after you’ve swallowed it. It’s still death to the Democrats.
if u carefully read my comment u will notice that i only used the word “good” to say something was not good, because it isnt good, non of it is and thats not what was asked the question was how is voting for democrats any better, yes its not good enough that much is self evident, i never said it was, that was never the claim i said it was better. there are 2 options at the federal level neither is good and again i didnt say either was but if u are going to bother to vote one is better.
ur response doesnt even engage with what i said at all, pointing out that the measures are half ass doesnt in any way contradict that they are better than the alternative of literally nothing, pointing out that biden is bad does not exclude the possibility that he is better. it is just mind boggling to me that some people can not understand the meaning of better and lesser it is just so bizarre.
It’s not that we can’t; it’s that we reject this relativist metric in favor of something absolute and quantifiable. Fact: Biden is no better materially for the people or the country. No change he’s put forward in his 3 and a half years of administration has resulted in ANY kind of MATERIAL improvement to the average Amerikan’s living conditions-- and in a lot of places, they’re worse!
After all, he’s responsible for the RICO charging of 61 Black Cop City protestors, he added to Trump’s wall, he’s still running the ‘detention’(read: concentration) camps at the southern border, Roe v Wade went away under his watch, several states have implemented even more draconian anti-abortion and anti-LGBTQ+ legislation under his watch; it goes on and on and on enough that we reject lesser/better comparison where he’s concerned.
He doesn’t deserve the puffery of relativist measurement.
Removed by mod
Actually student loaners should’ve crashed the economy without concessions
I’m not going to vote for someone giving full-throated endorsement and material support for genocide. If that isn’t a red line, nothing is.
To add to what OP said, the takeaway is that people should be taking politics elsewhere, making propaganda, picketing, whatever (of course, it’s better under a party, which would organize people in order to achieve some goals, but something, anything, is better than nothing). Electoralism didn’t achieve the 8-hour working day.