I like astrology i remember before i got off social media there was pretty cool comrades who examined like astrological placements during the Soviet revolution, which was very interesting to me…
It’s sort of strange that you would say that Indigenous peoples practiced the most “ancient, humble, sacred and beautiful” way of life but also blanket condemn astrology as “cosmic phrenology” and not a religion.
Have you ever actually spoken to an Indigenous person? Are you aware of the multitudes of astrological inspirations in Indigenous religions? One thing that is rather common in Turtle Island religions is a view that Indigenous people were born from the stars, the stars are kin and ancestor, and the stars can offer guidance and advice.
This is true in Indigenous religions all over. Celtic peoples also practiced a form of astrology that was violently suppressed by Christian missionaries in the early days of colonization.
Early Muslim astrologers (that’s right, astrologers, not astronomers) were mathematical pioneers.
Whether you believe it or not, it’s not for you to condemn its very existence when it offers comfort to many, is frequently applied to liberation and radical politics, and has never once been responsible for genocides, colonization, crusades…
You can block an astrology community, you know? You don’t have to engage with it. But there’s nothing more colonial than saying someone else’s spirituality is inherently reactionary and likening it to actual genocidal race science.
I think the “daughters of the witches you couldn’t burn” white middle-class aesthetic has made people a lot more critical of it than its relatively niche applications warrant, so it’s understandable. It does have a rich history in a lot of cultures, but that’s not what gets the optics, obviously, because what middle-class white people do is always the spotlight.
Whether you believe it or not, it’s not for you to condemn its very existence when it offers comfort to many, is frequently applied to liberation and radical politics, and has never once been responsible for genocides, colonization, crusades…>
Cite some sources for this claim, not take it in a confrontational tone. These are things that personally affect me, I don’t claim they are inherently anything, but its destructive power is experienced by people who you claim to speak behalf of. Astrology is complex, indigenous, used for radical cause but you haven’t lived in a society that practice it. Your fascination is only due to it being regarded as superstition by the westerners.
Cite some sources that there haven’t been astrology-based genocides or crusades??? What?
Also, I am, in fact, not even a little bit fascinated with or interested in astrology. Nor have I ever claimed to speak on behalf of anyone. However I do not agree with a stance that we should ban discussions surrounding religions. If your life has been severely impacted by astrology, then a communist astrology community would in fact be a perfect place for you to explain that, and a discussion about the application of astrology can be had.
Christianity has been used as a bludgeon against me and as a leverage for enacting anti-queer legislation. I would never presume to ban a christian community that sought to explore these ideas and apply the christian ideals of community and love to communism.
Spirituality is personal, and not to be controlled or censored insofar as it isn’t used to harm others, and negotiating that line and reimagining spirituality in a communist society is exactly the point of such communities on here.
Do not conflict religion, astrology and spirituality. I did not appeal to ban anything, anyone can start a community here. Spirituality in post rev society should be discussed and studied. I asked to cite sources for astrology used for radical causes . In anything that I said never dismissed religion nor spirituality but only astrology.
Astrology is spirituality for many people. It’s your personal dislike of astrology that leads to you setting it apart from religion and spirituality.
As for ways it has been used radically? Sure.
Jessica Dore is a licensed social worker, with a masters in social work, and ten years experience in clinical psychology, self-help and behavioural sciences. Her book Tarot for Change: Using the Cards for Self-Care, Acceptance and Growth applies the methods of cognitive behavioural therapy while using the metaphors and symbolism of Tarot as tools for self-reflection.
Alice Sparkly Kat, from Zengzhou, has a book, Post-Colonial Astrology: Reading the Planets Through Capital, Power and Labour which examines intersectionalities of oppression and the co-option of those very ideas by the capitalist class to continue to subjugate oppressed minorities and prioritize self over community.
Chani Nicholas, a Canadian astrologer whose wife founded a domestic abuse survivors charity, and who speaks publicly for queer and trans rights, wrote You Were Born For This: Astrology for Radical Self-Acceptance a book about using astrology as a tool for self-reflection, self-determination, and feminine empowerment, which advocates for a deeper understanding of your emotional and physical needs and the importance of conflict resolution in all relations.
The Holy Book of Women’s Mysteries by Zsuzsanna Budapest, while not one I would particularly recommend, does include important insights into women’s health and nutrition as an integral part of maintaining feminine power.
These are just the ones I know of.
My ancestors practiced a form of astrology that was violently suppressed by missionaries, so I was never given the opportunity to connect with or understand it from a cultural or spiritual place. But in a society where the subjugation of women and queer people is so deeply engrained, there are countless examples of predominantly women and queer people embracing a spiritual practice that allows them to feel some semblance of control, work through self-acceptance and self-governance (especially when legislative bodies work so hard to stamp out bodily autonomy) and begins to radicalize them in an understanding of how their material conditions are a direct response to the oppression of the ruling capitalist class and their accrual of wealth through primogeniture.
Such conversations do not in my opinion, run counter to the goals of communism.
And, again, if your personal experiences with astrology are negative, you would be more than free to have such discussions in such a community so that we can work to ensure that counter-revolutionary tendencies in spirituality can be held to account and worked through.
It’s truly no different than any religion in that regard: that is to say, there are religions that have been used to justify unprecedented levels of oppression and genocide, but the belief itself is not the problem, unless the purpose here is to demand atheistic purism, a thing no AES attempts, and was a violent stain on socialist Albania’s history.
Why not? (:
I like astrology i remember before i got off social media there was pretty cool comrades who examined like astrological placements during the Soviet revolution, which was very interesting to me…
Astrology (the pseudoscience), not astronomy?
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It’s sort of strange that you would say that Indigenous peoples practiced the most “ancient, humble, sacred and beautiful” way of life but also blanket condemn astrology as “cosmic phrenology” and not a religion.
Have you ever actually spoken to an Indigenous person? Are you aware of the multitudes of astrological inspirations in Indigenous religions? One thing that is rather common in Turtle Island religions is a view that Indigenous people were born from the stars, the stars are kin and ancestor, and the stars can offer guidance and advice.
This is true in Indigenous religions all over. Celtic peoples also practiced a form of astrology that was violently suppressed by Christian missionaries in the early days of colonization.
Early Muslim astrologers (that’s right, astrologers, not astronomers) were mathematical pioneers.
Whether you believe it or not, it’s not for you to condemn its very existence when it offers comfort to many, is frequently applied to liberation and radical politics, and has never once been responsible for genocides, colonization, crusades…
You can block an astrology community, you know? You don’t have to engage with it. But there’s nothing more colonial than saying someone else’s spirituality is inherently reactionary and likening it to actual genocidal race science.
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Thank you so much
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I think the “daughters of the witches you couldn’t burn” white middle-class aesthetic has made people a lot more critical of it than its relatively niche applications warrant, so it’s understandable. It does have a rich history in a lot of cultures, but that’s not what gets the optics, obviously, because what middle-class white people do is always the spotlight.
I am not white, so I’m not surprised by the reaction i got here
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Cite some sources for this claim, not take it in a confrontational tone. These are things that personally affect me, I don’t claim they are inherently anything, but its destructive power is experienced by people who you claim to speak behalf of. Astrology is complex, indigenous, used for radical cause but you haven’t lived in a society that practice it. Your fascination is only due to it being regarded as superstition by the westerners.
Cite some sources that there haven’t been astrology-based genocides or crusades??? What?
Also, I am, in fact, not even a little bit fascinated with or interested in astrology. Nor have I ever claimed to speak on behalf of anyone. However I do not agree with a stance that we should ban discussions surrounding religions. If your life has been severely impacted by astrology, then a communist astrology community would in fact be a perfect place for you to explain that, and a discussion about the application of astrology can be had.
Christianity has been used as a bludgeon against me and as a leverage for enacting anti-queer legislation. I would never presume to ban a christian community that sought to explore these ideas and apply the christian ideals of community and love to communism.
Spirituality is personal, and not to be controlled or censored insofar as it isn’t used to harm others, and negotiating that line and reimagining spirituality in a communist society is exactly the point of such communities on here.
Do not conflict religion, astrology and spirituality. I did not appeal to ban anything, anyone can start a community here. Spirituality in post rev society should be discussed and studied. I asked to cite sources for astrology used for radical causes . In anything that I said never dismissed religion nor spirituality but only astrology.
Astrology is spirituality for many people. It’s your personal dislike of astrology that leads to you setting it apart from religion and spirituality.
As for ways it has been used radically? Sure.
Jessica Dore is a licensed social worker, with a masters in social work, and ten years experience in clinical psychology, self-help and behavioural sciences. Her book Tarot for Change: Using the Cards for Self-Care, Acceptance and Growth applies the methods of cognitive behavioural therapy while using the metaphors and symbolism of Tarot as tools for self-reflection.
Alice Sparkly Kat, from Zengzhou, has a book, Post-Colonial Astrology: Reading the Planets Through Capital, Power and Labour which examines intersectionalities of oppression and the co-option of those very ideas by the capitalist class to continue to subjugate oppressed minorities and prioritize self over community.
Chani Nicholas, a Canadian astrologer whose wife founded a domestic abuse survivors charity, and who speaks publicly for queer and trans rights, wrote You Were Born For This: Astrology for Radical Self-Acceptance a book about using astrology as a tool for self-reflection, self-determination, and feminine empowerment, which advocates for a deeper understanding of your emotional and physical needs and the importance of conflict resolution in all relations.
The Holy Book of Women’s Mysteries by Zsuzsanna Budapest, while not one I would particularly recommend, does include important insights into women’s health and nutrition as an integral part of maintaining feminine power.
These are just the ones I know of.
My ancestors practiced a form of astrology that was violently suppressed by missionaries, so I was never given the opportunity to connect with or understand it from a cultural or spiritual place. But in a society where the subjugation of women and queer people is so deeply engrained, there are countless examples of predominantly women and queer people embracing a spiritual practice that allows them to feel some semblance of control, work through self-acceptance and self-governance (especially when legislative bodies work so hard to stamp out bodily autonomy) and begins to radicalize them in an understanding of how their material conditions are a direct response to the oppression of the ruling capitalist class and their accrual of wealth through primogeniture.
Such conversations do not in my opinion, run counter to the goals of communism.
And, again, if your personal experiences with astrology are negative, you would be more than free to have such discussions in such a community so that we can work to ensure that counter-revolutionary tendencies in spirituality can be held to account and worked through.
It’s truly no different than any religion in that regard: that is to say, there are religions that have been used to justify unprecedented levels of oppression and genocide, but the belief itself is not the problem, unless the purpose here is to demand atheistic purism, a thing no AES attempts, and was a violent stain on socialist Albania’s history.