Hi,
jlai.lu is the french instance of Lemmy, some user posted this thread 16 days ago : https://jlai.lu/post/11504685, and a flamewar ensued between hexbear and the french, e.g. between happybadger and their administrator here.
Since they didn’t really have any reason to defederate initially, they’re now adamant that they should defederate only because of this discussion, since it proved that every Hexbear&Lemmygrad user is agressive(, as if jlai.lu users weren’t agressive in this discussion as well).
I still find hard to believe that they could defederate on such weak basis, and it does feel like a convenient excuse, but that’s what they’re saying, ask them for confirmation if you don’t believe it either.
They also used a list of post found on /c/MeanwhileOnGrad@sh.itjust.works as if it was representative, but it hardly counts as an argument, what a stupid situation…
They’ve now pinned this post for 12 days, and the defederation with both Hexbear and Lemmygrad seems unavoidable.
I’ve known this for more than a week but didn’t care that much, yet when talking with them, and especially @Camus here, they/he said that they/he would like to talk to you. @Camus is very patient/nice, and you can look at his number of comments/posts to gauge his influence, probably their most active user(, kind of a french ☆ Yσɠƚԋσʂ ☆).
Well, to be more precise, he informally asked for some excuses from Hexbear, but my post here didn’t reach them, perhaps because of “r*tard” in my username(, r*tardataire designate someone who’s late in french).
However, more than excuses in the name of others, you only have to show him that we’re not aggressive(, if you have some time, it won’t change much in the end), something very easy/natural to prove for >90% of Hexbear users(, and perhaps >70-80% of Lemmygrad 🙂, it does feel a bit more bitter/serious here, not a criticism).
They have some communities that aren’t that far apart from what could be found on Lemmygrad or Hexbear b.t.w., so it can’t really be said that they’d reject us solely based on terrorism apologia, supporting Stalin, etc.(, even if their “leftist” admin is against socialist countries because our capitalists said that they’re authoritarian).
Staying federated with a french instance would be useless for 99% of Hexbear and Lemmygrad, so if you intervene it’d mostly be on the behalf of current/future french users(, it can be nice sometimes to speak your native language without using an alt account), and perhaps also for Lemmygrad and Hexbear’s reputation on jlai.lu.
If you’re french, and/or simply nice, and want a chat with them, feel free to do so directly under the post or with @Camus.
(Kinda worth mentionning in passing that, currently, their top two posts of all time sorted by the most comments are the ones cited above about this defederation)
Also, keep in mind that this defederation is unavoidable though, if it doesn’t happen now it’ll be next year or the year after. As you know, reddit banned ChapoTrapHouse, GenZedong, etc., and we were quickly banned from lemmy.world and others, so we’ll one day be banned from other “centrist” instances such as the french one. Just like we’d also be banned/censored by our governement if our numbers grow enough to disturb/‘be a threat’.
Furthermore, Hexbear took action, and decided to defederate first without even trying to discuss more calmly. So don’t waste too much of your time either(, but please don’t go there unless you intent to speak calmly).
Thanks for reading :) !
I never heard about it before either : https://zhongwenhub.com/frog-in-the-well-5-ways-to-use-the-chinese-idiom/
Here’s the wiki, and out of the 348 fables translated in english here, it is among the 20 ones translated in other languages
I’ve already said that both sides fueled the flamewar, but it’s worth adding that anansi agreed there was a great deal of shitposting that day, and honestly i also feel that it’s worth repeating that it’s not a good reason to defederate because of that since it doesn’t happen often.
Furthermore, it did happen under a post that was vexing, usually a warning followed by a temporary ban towards the angriest(/hurt) members of Hexbear and Lemmygrad could be resorted to in order to appease some tensions, defederating wasn’t an option on reddit. It feels like jlai.lu shouldn’t defederate with Hexbear and Lemmygrad at least if it’s solely for this reason.
That has nothing to do with the fable you found; it’s very plainly “those people I’m comparing to Nazis should be killed like Nazis.” Surprise surprise, “it’s a joke bro!” yet again turns out to be bullshit.
Excellent point, i forgot to explain, here’s the comment :
Which in french is :
Mon avis personnel, pour ceux que ça intéresse, est que ces deux instances sont remplies de ce qu’on qualifie ici de rouges-bruns, tankies, ou encore fascistes de gauche.
Ce sont avant tout des autoritaires qui aiment se dire de gauche, mais utilisent les mêmes outils, ont la même vision politique, la même organisation, et ont tendance politiquement et historiquement à s’allier aux fascistes “officiels” dès qu’un mouvement réellement de gauche révolutionnaire émerge.
Je trouvais tolérable de “ne rien faire” tant qu’ils restaient dans leurs coins, mais j’avais un peu oublié qu’un autoritaire reste un autoritaire et que la seule place qu’ils méritent est dans un puits, en n’oubliant pas de frapper les mains qui tentent de sortir avec un gros bâton.
In English :
My personal opinion, for those who care, is that these two instances are filled with what we call here red-browns, tankies, or even left-wing fascists.
They are primarily authoritarians who like to call themselves leftists, but they use the same tools, have the same political vision, the same organization, and tend politically and historically to align themselves with “official” fascists as soon as a genuinely revolutionary left-wing movement emerges.
I found it tolerable to “do nothing” as long as they stayed in their own corner, but I had somewhat forgotten that an authoritarian remains an authoritarian and that the only place they deserve is in a well, not forgetting to strike the hands that try to climb out with a big stick.
In this metaphor we, the authoritarians, are trapped in a well, with a narrow mindview, just like the frog, who believes that the small circle of sky s.he sees from the bottom of the well represents all there is.
I guess that it’s also true that he spoke of putting back the frog if s.he wants to see the outside world, but hey, it wasn’t a lie though, and there’s possibly also some version with a stick somewhere i haven’t checked in depth.
The link with the 348 tales clearly wasn’t relevant to understand the context of the well, with a frog in it(, appropriate for a french b.t.w.), but it’s a real thing in the chinese culture, the first link had this quote for instance :
For added context, here’s the mention of the frog, and here’s the one prior to that on hexbear : https://hexbear.net/post/3822135/5583877
That fable thing sounds like a bullshit excuse tbh.
Suppose he hates communists because he thinks their opinions are narrow, but when they try to get out of the well he beats them up so they stay in it, unable to expand their views and change? If he hates communists, why would he want them not to grow? That doesn’t make sense and he’s just trying to do some damage control to not look like a psycho.
Or maybe it true and he really thought it was witty, genuinely not seeing how dumb it actually is. But I doubt it.
Yeah, I understand the argument that “let’s throw them in a well and make sure they don’t get out” is related to the fable – I just don’t buy it.
It’d be like claiming “face the wall” is a lighthearted reference to Humpty Dumpty.