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As if extensions on kde wouldn’t break. How many outdated extensions are there on kde right now? Last time I checked it wasn’t only one or two.
Just because everything is shipped with kde doesn’t mean that gnome is worse because you have to install one more app. Yes it should be included but that’s not my decision to make.
My point being that KDE doesn’t need these extensions for what one might (as a beginner coming from Windows) consider essential functionality. I don’t even use any non-preinstalled/third-party KDE extensions but I am using an extension for tray icons whenever I use GNOME, because it’s just a fact of life for me that I use applications that make use of a tray icon where I don’t want to lose the functionality. It’s not about “GNOME extensions break while KDE extensions don’t”, it’s just more likely that a beginner would want to use extensions with GNOME and is probably less likely to want/need them with KDE. Context matters here :)
I also never said that GNOME is worse, just that KDE is probably better for beginners because the default out-of-the-box configuration is more feature complete when you expect certain features Windows has - which, like it or not, is where most beginners are coming from.
I understand your frustration, yet I don’t think one is better than the other. I’d use KDE if it wasn’t for paperwm
Doesn’t GNOME work towards the android style where you have the notification that apps/processes are running in background? It’s not yet perfect but they work on it.
I haven’t used tray icons extensively on windows. I installed them on GNOME when I moved to gnome but they got lost somewhere along my distro hopping path.
Are you talking about persistent “notifications” that stay in the notification list and can show for example media controls? I think for media players using certain (cross-desktop) APIs it can do that automatically, but other apps would need to have that feature added specifically as far as I’m aware.
I don’t dislike GNOME and in isolation, it’s probably more forward-thinking and sometimes even makes more sense than KDE. But the reality is that most applications don’t specifically cater to GNOME, including the ones I’ve listed. Even Valve, which invests a lot into supporting Linux, doesn’t specifically support GNOME with Steam. If you close all Steam windows, Steam is apparently gone (but it’s obviously still running). I’m not even sure if it still shows up in the “dock” as running that way?
I think GNOME’s philosophy of not adding every feature anybody could want to have is good. They are clearly focused on their vision and leave the rest to extensions via an API that breaks compatibility rather often, but is otherwise very extensive.
But my point still stands: for a beginner coming from Windows - which is what I assume where most Linux beginners come from - KDE feels more at home, matching pretty much everything Windows Explorer (or whatever you want to call that desktop environment) does: there is a task bar that by default pretty much behaves like the Windows taskbar, the tray icons area works in much the same way, you can minimize windows, the start menu offers search and a list of applications etc. What you already know from Windows will get you quite far in KDE. It then adds a ton of configurable functionality on top and that’s where it gets more complicated, but most users (especially beginners) won’t even want to fiddle around with this stuff.
If we’re talking about a beginner as being someone who is new to computing in general: well, take your pick.
As if extensions on kde wouldn’t break. How many outdated extensions are there on kde right now? Last time I checked it wasn’t only one or two.
Just because everything is shipped with kde doesn’t mean that gnome is worse because you have to install one more app. Yes it should be included but that’s not my decision to make.
My point being that KDE doesn’t need these extensions for what one might (as a beginner coming from Windows) consider essential functionality. I don’t even use any non-preinstalled/third-party KDE extensions but I am using an extension for tray icons whenever I use GNOME, because it’s just a fact of life for me that I use applications that make use of a tray icon where I don’t want to lose the functionality. It’s not about “GNOME extensions break while KDE extensions don’t”, it’s just more likely that a beginner would want to use extensions with GNOME and is probably less likely to want/need them with KDE. Context matters here :)
I also never said that GNOME is worse, just that KDE is probably better for beginners because the default out-of-the-box configuration is more feature complete when you expect certain features Windows has - which, like it or not, is where most beginners are coming from.
I understand your frustration, yet I don’t think one is better than the other. I’d use KDE if it wasn’t for paperwm
Doesn’t GNOME work towards the android style where you have the notification that apps/processes are running in background? It’s not yet perfect but they work on it. I haven’t used tray icons extensively on windows. I installed them on GNOME when I moved to gnome but they got lost somewhere along my distro hopping path.
Are you talking about persistent “notifications” that stay in the notification list and can show for example media controls? I think for media players using certain (cross-desktop) APIs it can do that automatically, but other apps would need to have that feature added specifically as far as I’m aware.
I don’t dislike GNOME and in isolation, it’s probably more forward-thinking and sometimes even makes more sense than KDE. But the reality is that most applications don’t specifically cater to GNOME, including the ones I’ve listed. Even Valve, which invests a lot into supporting Linux, doesn’t specifically support GNOME with Steam. If you close all Steam windows, Steam is apparently gone (but it’s obviously still running). I’m not even sure if it still shows up in the “dock” as running that way?
I think GNOME’s philosophy of not adding every feature anybody could want to have is good. They are clearly focused on their vision and leave the rest to extensions via an API that breaks compatibility rather often, but is otherwise very extensive.
But my point still stands: for a beginner coming from Windows - which is what I assume where most Linux beginners come from - KDE feels more at home, matching pretty much everything Windows Explorer (or whatever you want to call that desktop environment) does: there is a task bar that by default pretty much behaves like the Windows taskbar, the tray icons area works in much the same way, you can minimize windows, the start menu offers search and a list of applications etc. What you already know from Windows will get you quite far in KDE. It then adds a ton of configurable functionality on top and that’s where it gets more complicated, but most users (especially beginners) won’t even want to fiddle around with this stuff.
If we’re talking about a beginner as being someone who is new to computing in general: well, take your pick.