As a Linux newcomer the Wayland/X11 thing has been the most confusing thing I’ve witnessed.
Surely the average person will just use what works best on their system at that time? I don’t get people wishing to throw Wayland in the trash or the people who take issue with people still using X11.
Kinda just seems like arguing because you have nothing better to do.
It’s an age old Linux tradition. We argue about window managers, init systems, sound systems, and anything else we can. Often it’s because people have built a hacked together system based on what used to work for them. Relevant XKCD
Hahaha that damn spacebar heating in KDE 4.2 was really lit
And it’s fine when it’s about a roughly equal choice. But Wayland is vastly superior in support and X11 vastly superior in functionality, so I don’t get this argument.
If I could find a compositor for Wayland (and a simple terminal emulator like urxvt, no opengl for acceleration please) as easy and quick to set up as cwm for X11 (with something like dzen2) or fvwm - the issue wouldn’t exist for me personally.
Kinda just seems like arguing because you have nothing better to do.
When we don’t have Windows or Mac users to feel superior against, we will invent issues amongst ourselves.
Kinda just seems like arguing because you have nothing better to do.
You don’t seem confused at all. You summed it up nicely.
And, here me out here: this is a good thing. Nay, a beautiful thing. There are no better things to do because these people care and have a voice. We argue about things for years and make slow progress as people agree or capitulate, and there will always be a fork to avoid those changes people care to enough. No one can just buy the Linux ecosystem and make unpopular changes without broad support. I’m pretty sure a negligible number of people have genuine hatred or prejudice for those using a technology they don’t like. The arguing of Linux and Open Source is a reflection of the most successful form of worldwide democracy ever implemented by mankind.
i started using linux 3 years ago because i literally didn’t have nothing better todo ‘-’
Welcome to the Linux community!
Seriously, though. Just use what you want (as long as it’s working and supported, of course). Don’t let anyone here pressure you.
Just use a Distro that has it preset. Ubuntu, Fedora, I dont know what else.
Ubuntu LTS and 23.x are both Xorg. Latest has Wayland. If 24.04 is to be LTS though, I don’t think they’d release it with Wayland as default. I’d think they’d switch to Wayland on 24.10 so there’s 3 more releases to get good before the next LTS build.
Damn… so StudioOne on their “Linux info page” was wrong. They only support Ubuntu (sigh…) but also only Wayland.
A good start for a Flatpak? Maybe if it wasnt proprietary…
Possible I’m wrong? I was going against the Distrowatch details since I was just looking at them a couple hours before I replied: https://distrowatch.com/table-mobile.php?distribution=ubuntu
I don’t usually “trust” vendor support for Linux though…Linux is usually a second-class citizen and “support” means there is either a single grey-beard or an intern that’s answering emails about it. Idk about StudioOne, but unfortunately it’s usually expected to not have feature parity or complete documentation for commercial software on Linux. IME, YMMV, etc.
They dont support it at all currently but have an experimental version. As if that was too much, with their software costing 200€+
Ubuntu 21.04 uses Wayland by default https://canonical.com/blog/ubuntu-21-04-is-here
My mistake, then. I haven’t really used Ubuntu much since focal. I was going off the package list in distrowatch.
I’m pretty sure 22.04 and newer are Wayland.
There is no one devoloping for x11 anymore, it is abandonware and dead (even if still usefully sometimes) wayland isn’t the new shiny thing but it has been getting devoloped so so slowly and getting little support, because the focus on x11. Death of x11 is better for everyone
Is something like barrier/synergy already working with wayland?
I wanted to try it so badly, but controlling multiple computers with one set of keyboard & mouse is quite essential to my workflow.Also, does X forwarding over ssh work in some way?
Like, can I open remote GUI programs over ssh on my wayland, like on X11? And less important for me, but still, also the other way round?Thanks upfront!
I have some FOMO here, but last time I checked wayland couldn’t provide me those things, I need for work :-(
I just switched from fedora 39 plasma to green debian, it’s been very pleasant to have “it just works os” take care of things, including X11 just doing it’s regular old thing.
But if course, Wayland is the future and I will happily use it by the time it becomes stable enough for a debian release. Go Wayland!
This is the way.
land
Debian has had Wayland for ages tho. It’s the default for Gnome since 2019.
You’re right, I didn’t think of that. Cinnamon sadly is X11 for now.
what’s green debian? debian with cinnamon?
Probably LMDE?
Yup, lmde
So a small tip, dont use Cinnamon XD but everyone uses what they prefer
The whole point of using Linux is the freedom that we can use what we want. Don’t play down other DEs you might not like, because the variety is what makes our environment amazing.
You can use what you want. I just say X11 is not developed anymore really, since years. It is decades old and insecure by design. Wayland just works, if not supported XWayland is chosen automatically.
If you use MacOS or Windows today, you will see that Linux has no permission system at all. This is simply insecure.
I like cheese so I should use X11
I… Like… potatoes…?
I thought you loved the foot-y goodness?
Based and cheesepilled
Not sure where the current wave of FHFIF memes are coming from, but I’m here for it lmao
I’m an adamant believer in its untapped meme potential
should watch some of it again tbh, watched it as a kid and I loved Wander Over Yonder, one of McCracken’s other shows.
What show is this?
stupid old man rant:
spoiler
KDE making random features only available on wayland for no reason like trackpad gestures because memes
GNOME being GNOME which is being useless anyway
And literally everyone else is still using X11 by default, unless you count the 20 random github compositors that no one uses.
I would switch to wayland if it had any actual immediate benefit, especially in performance, but as far as I have tested it doesn’t.
Will probably join it in 2030 when the xfce devs wake up from their eternal slumber and make an update for it
Used Wayland, tried Hyprland. Was cool, somewhat buggy.
Switched to XMonad. No more issues.
Wayland is probably the future, but I just want something that works now.
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Unless you’re using that piece of shit Nvidia
Not only is Wayland incredibly more secure than X11 can ever be, and definitely isn’t, Wayland is straight up more smooth and faster, and has many more features. Maybe not all of those features are visible to you for your workload, but for example stuff like HDR are going to make a huge difference between old X11 and Wayland.
Literally every other OS has been doing things the Wayland way for quite a long time now. It’s just on *nix that we have to deal with so many people’s bullshit and mental fear of change.
Well x11 apps are in Xephyr
I would switch if all my DWM patches worked on DWL, but till they write the same patches for DWL I’m sticking with X11
if all my DWM patches were on DWL
Nothing stops you from making it yourself.
Not everyone has the skill and time to just make it themselves, mate.
I do have a long term goal of learning C and making an actually good sixel patch, but that’s for ST. Like sure Wayland gets rid of the screen tearing I occasionally get on my old Intel GPU in my laptop, but why would I spend so much time porting patches when X11 when that’s my only gripe with it.
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Anyone that still wants to use x11 can attempt to maintain it themselves.
