Why do people watch movies when books exist? They’re different mediums for delivering a story.
I saw this thread and assumed you were talking about actual walking simulators like Firewatch or Gone Home, ones that don’t really have any gameplay mechanics besides walking and interacting with objects. But from your comments you seem to be taking issue with games like God of War, The Last of Us and The Witcher which makes me think you’re a little misguided as to what those games really are. Those games have a story but that’s not the sole reason they’re popular. They’re all groundbreaking titles in their own right from a technical perspective, they just happen to have good stories because that makes them resonate with players even more.
It’s like how a movie with a bunch great fight scenes and no story isn’t going to resonate with audiences in the same way as a movie with great fight scenes and a story to tie it all together. It’s an important part of the immersive experience for a lot of people.
This is an honest question, not a troll: what makes The Last of Us groundbreaking from a technical perspective? I played it and loved the story, but the gameplay was utterly boring to me. I got through the game entirely because I wanted to see the conclusion of the story and when the HBO show came out I was thrilled because it meant I wouldn’t have to play a game I hated to see the story of TLoU 2.
It’s been years, but my recollection is the game was entirely on rails, mostly walking and talking with infrequent bursts of quicktime events and clunky shooting. What was groundbreaking about it?
What was groundbreaking was the character and world building. Joel and Ellie feel like real people, with interesting backstories and relatable emotions. In the PS3 era, it felt ahead of its time.
… which are not technical elements, but writing, thus the question stands.
Well, a movie and a book are quite different. I think OP’s point, right or wrong, is that a story-based game with minimal or no gameplay is very close to exactly what a movie is.
The older I get the less I care about endless gameplay loops and carrot on a stick mechanics. A good story keeps me invested and caring about what happens on the screen. Games like God of War, Last of us, Witcher are gold standards when it comes to this. They are not movies on rails, they are engaging and interactive experiences like you can’t find anywhere else and for this I will always love these types of games more than any other medium.
Edit: OP literally mentioned these games as examples lower down in the thread.
I feel like your examples aren’t quite what OP was referring to. Those games have pretty great gameplay
According to OP, those are exactly the games they referred to. Which does beg more questions
OK OP is a weirdo, my bad
i think they might mean more something along the lines of telltale games. and there’s definitely been more than one mediocre story driven adventure with bad gameplay, we just don’t remember them as easily. also, a lot of people really don’t get the appeal of role playing. so games like baldur’s gate might come off as “old ass gameplay on top of a long winded boring story” to the someone who also doesn’t like of turn based combat. I could even see a somewhat valid complaint if they were mad about QuickTime events seeming to be more common than ever. I thought those would be a relic of the past 10 years ago… looking at you spider man! every super hero game really. why are these still a thing? who likes them?
No OP literally replied lower down in the thread using those examples
damn yeah that’s a pretty lame take.
I think Telltale and those like it would be even worse examples than God Of War and etcetera. These games add a new dimension to the experience by providing ways for the viewer/player to influence the story. The only thing I could conflate it with would be CYOA books, which obviously are a conpletely different medium.
Those games have pretty great gameplay
God of War is basically a button masher. I remember liking The Last of Us, but it was new when I played it, so I don’t remember much of the gameplay. Can’t speak to the Witcher
I really like the characters and voice/motion acting in Baldur’s Gate 3. Magnificently rendered. Very well written. But the story is totally on rails. You can nod your head at an NPC and they will say “Anyway, let’s get on with things…” or you can tell that NPC to eat shit and die and they will say “Hey no need to be vulgar. Anyway let’s get on with things…”
There are some branches and choices in the game but overall it feels pretty prepared. I enjoy hunting for fun Astarion reactions to random things, but the game frequently offers fake choices, and the consequences of choices are usually 1. the story continues as written or 2. the story thread just ends 3. oh no combat or 4. some really weak alternative thread that you know isn’t the main one and they threw in just to pad.
Games are not superior medium for telling stories. All the good parts are the ones taken from movies, and the interactivity is still weak. When a game has GPT-level improvisation then I’ll be impressed but that will just be a sandbox anyway.
“Why do people have preferences?”
Why do people like cake, I just don’t get it. Why not just eat cookies if you want something sweet
As I scroll this thread I’m really wondering how much people still read books. When people say they like story games, is that because that’s the only source of stories in their lives, and they’re saying “of course I like stories?” Do they have any great stories to compare with, from books?
The responses make a great deal more sense to me if I assume no one reads anymore. I speak as an avid reader and gamer.
I’d like to think I’m an avid reader (and gamer) as well. I view both highly and both have their strengths.
SPOILERS
Video games shine in terms of player interactivity. I genuinely felt visceral, strong emotions by simply having to press the square button 3 times in TLOU2. Bashing someone’s head in is the only way to proceed. The music gets more distorted, the screen itself becomes blurry – I felt as Ellie felt. Distraught, upset, angry, and everything else in between.
I felt the acceptance that I have been honing in my countless loops of Outer Wilds when I finally pulled the system’s “life support” out. Flying through space one last time while the music echoes this final journey really made me feel things.
I’d summarise the edge video games have as “This is what you (the player) have done. You have agency. Deal with the consequences of your own actions, or reap the benefits.”
A huge disclaimer, I know that the story is already established in the writers room. I’m not saying that games allow you to craft your own story. I’m saying that they allow you to craft your own experience.
Of course, great writers can accomplish the same. I love Atwood’s writing in particular, and she does conjure up wonderful emotions. But you always feel for someone or something. You don’t have any agency in what happens, so emotions tend to be dampened as well. That’s my personal opinion anyway, feel free to disregard it!
I think you’re totally right about placing the “reader” in a position of agency and how that gives the story greater impact.
I also think it really fences game stories in, too, because people would object to being certain kinds of characters, or making certain kinds of choices.
Either you have to give the gamer palatable choices, or they feel dissociated from their character, like “well fuck okay I’ll do it but this is clearly not what I would rather do,” and that greater impact is undermined.
Some games excel at finding the tricky balance point where you aren’t quite sure what you would do and really have to think and consider the consequences because you’re invested in both directions. But you can only cram so many such moments into a plot before it becomes obvious.
Yeap fully agreed here as well. I do think the medium itself is shackled by its own chains, but my goodness when you find a game that does it well – the feeling is astounding.
I guess it depends on the player as well. I adored how TLOU2 handled its story but most people might disagree.
Anyway, I’ve come to the realisation that I’ve mostly been reading non fiction lately! Maybe that’s why I’m so fiction starved.
If you’ve any books to recommend I’d love to hear them!
This is the weirdest comments section I’ve ever seen. Stories are why I play every single one of my favourite games. I just finished Control and it’s absolutely phenomenal. Yes it plays and looks great, but the story and lore is why it’s so good.
< The Board thanks/precipitates you for your contribution/factotum >
Well it is a game/story from Sam lake, for me that means good. I hope he has a few more games in him.
Please take this as a genuine question and not an insult or challenge: do you read books? I’m curious if games are just the way you consume stories in your life, or if you also read stories but game stories are different in some way that matters to you.
I listen to an audiobook every day, watch TV and movies regularly.
an interactive medium offers unique avenues for storytelling not available to something more static like a film or a novel.
think things like environmental storytelling or branching narratives.
I like visual novels because of how I can change the story with different choices. This isn’t much gameplay but it is still interactive and a lot easier to do with a computer than with manually flipping between pages in a Choose Your Own Adventure book.
Now, kinetic novels, where you do not change anything significant in the story with your choices, those I agree with OP’s sentiment. Some people like them and that’s totally fine, but I personally don’t see the appeal. Maybe it’s getting exposure to stories from people who had an idea but not a high enough budget for a movie?
Damn straight, beefcat
Now there’s a sentence I never thought I’d type
branching narratives
Lots of “plot only” games I see start to eschew even that and have tons of fake choices lmao, making it even movie-er.
Yea dude this is often such a false promise, im sure some games pull it off but often its like one choice that makes a drastic difference in outcome.many times it’s not like a nuanced calculation of the decisions you make over an entire playthrough
What games are we even talking about? Like Gone Home or something?
The perception of choice still matters. A movie can’t ask you to choose anything, not even a false choice. So if that’s important, a movie simply can’t do it.
For me personally, video games are interactive stories. I love movies and TV shows, and being able to have some level of control over the action is an amazing experience for me!
I’m also not competitive and don’t care so much about scores, rankings, or online multiplayer vs. games. Just give me an intriguing plot and let me be the protagonist in it. I’ll play that game for hours on end.
I don’t like games that are essentially movies with a few interactive scenes between clips, though. It has to be really interesting if I’m going to sit through a game like that. I’m here to play, not to watch. The only series that’s been interesting enough for me to deal with hundreds of cutscenes dispersed every few minutes throughout is the Metal Gear Solid series.
I realize I don’t speak for the whole gaming community, but this is my personal view.
On PC - Steam alone, 12000 games were released in 2023.
OP, your statement is vague and generic. Please show the math.
In a game, you’re the protagonist. In a movie, someone else is. Two different experiences.
Because all you name below are AAA games where everyone wants to flex their budget. It’s like asking “why do big budget movies focus so often on explosions and action, instead of stories? What happened to things like Shawshank Redemption?”
As soon as you step away from big AAA games that lean heavily on cinematic influence, you get much more gameplay-focused content. I could name a million of them.
But it’s a spectrum, not an on/off switch. There’s a huge array of different types of games with different combinations of action, cinematics, dialog, quick-time events, racing, flying, rhythm-matching, puzzles, and on and on and on
Tell us what you’re actually looking for and we could give suggestions :)
Don’t tell us what you don’t want. Tell us what interests you
Even if a game technically has great gameplay, it can start to feel pointless if the story is trash.
Involvement. Because no matter how perfect the gameplay is, if you use your brain occaisonally, you should ask yourself WHY? Why am i doing it.
If you play since the 80‘s, you hit, flew, drove, shot, build and puzzled almost everything.
Stories consist of motivations. Otherwise there is nothing of consequence going on. But cheer up. There are many more people like you, Stanley. Push the button. Keep pushing it.
Almost everything in this world stresses me out.
I want to feel involved in something while going at my own pace. Video games give me to power to finally be in control. That’s why I like them so much. Movies force you along.
These days? Remember Dragon’s Lair?
Dungeon quest. Oregon trail. Materia Magica. And a dozen other MUDs
Movies aren’t interactive.
Tell that to Netflix.
That was so good
I would argue that all games have a story. Some have a scripted narrative–which, in the medium of video games, gives the player their own immersive role in the story–while other games give you the tools to create your own story as you play. You face conflicts and use your abilities and the resources around you to overcome them, ideally resulting in a satisfying progression throughout your playtime.
Both are cool for different reasons.
Tetris has story?
It’s a terrible tale of oppression if you read between the blocks.
I asked ChatGPT to give me a narrative backstory of Tetris relating to oppression. You’re welcome:
In the realm of Tetris, each distinctive piece represents a fighter in a symbolic battle against oppression, embodying resilience and unity:
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L-Block (Lenny): Lenny is the ingenious rebel, always finding clever ways to subvert the oppressor’s plans. His ability to fit into tight spots and support others symbolizes the fight against constraints and the power of innovative thinking.
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J-Block (Jolene): Jolene represents the underestimated resistance. Often overlooked, her strength lies in her subtle yet impactful actions. She symbolizes the quiet but fierce fight against oppression, proving that every action, no matter how small, counts.
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I-Block (Ivan): Ivan stands tall as the beacon of hope and solidarity. He represents the unwavering spirit of the oppressed, a reminder that standing firm and united can disrupt the oppressor’s designs.
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O-Block (Olivia): Olivia embodies unity and cooperation. Her simple form represents the power of solidarity, showing how coming together can create an unbreakable force against tyranny.
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S-Block (Sam): Sam is the symbol of unconventional resistance. His unique approach represents the innovative strategies used to outmaneuver oppressors, celebrating the creativity and adaptability of those fighting for freedom.
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Z-Block (Zara): Zara, like Sam, challenges the status quo. She embodies the courage to be different and the strength found in diversity, essential in the struggle against a monolithic oppressor.
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T-Block (Theo): Theo is the mastermind of the resistance, his versatile nature representing the strategic planning needed to overcome oppression. He signifies the importance of adaptability and foresight in the fight for liberation.
In this narrative of Tetris, the game becomes a metaphor for resistance against oppression. Each piece, with its unique qualities, plays a crucial role in the larger strategy of defying and dismantling oppressive structures. Their world is a constantly shifting battlefield where unity, creativity, and resilience are key to surviving and triumphing over tyranny.
Ivan 100% Tetrises himself to save the others that have yet to fall. It’s just the kind of block he is.
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Sure. The premise is that blocks are falling and can’t be allowed to reach a certain height. There is drama in knowing that, no matter what, it will eventually reach that height. You’re given the tools to fend off the inevitable for as long as you can. There’s conflict, resolution, and the plot details are determined both by the decisions you make and the order in which the game delivers the blocks to you. You are the protagonist, the computer is the antagonist. There’s a beginning, middle, and end to every game. It’s as reductive as stories get, but it’s a story.
I, I like the way you think.
I stand corrected. :)
The story of Tetris is the story of the entire history of Russia.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hWTFG3J1CP8
Enjoy :)
I think I disagree that all games have a story because there are a lot of games that are closer to sports than interactive stories. Mostly multiplayer games like fps’s and rocket League, but also a lot of single player driving games like mudrunner or any of the rally games.
Most analogue games fall in the sports category too imo. There’s no story to poker, and you really shouldn’t overthink the lore of chess.
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