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I know the comments are immediately filled by these assholes but I’m glad they are being down voted and OP is being up voted.
Its so akward to engage with people like that… it’s like people supporting russia because ukraine is supported by america. 2 can be shit at once. Its not that hard.
If isis starts attacking israel, that does not mean you need to support isis…
if in some bizzare, hypothetical fantasy world, isis somehow invaded israel and stopped the ongoing genocide there and delivered a perfect two state solution overnight, would you be morally against specifically that action because it was isis who did it?
to be clear, i’m not asking whether you’d be against isis as a whole: just whether you’d be against isis ending the current israel-palestine situation peacefully
If they did that I’d be grateful to them. And if I had wheels I’d be a wagon.
so you agree that a group can do bad things, or even be on the whole bad by a very wide margin, but still do something good worthy of praise?
Yes? Is that supposed to be a gotcha?
If isis starts attacking israel, that does not mean you need to support isis…
it was a response to this, which in the context of the original post, has a sentiment that directly contradicts what you just agreed with
Acknowledging that a terrible organization has done something good doesn’t mean I support them.
the meme never mentions supporting houthis, it says praising them
acknowledging somebody has done something good is praising them
hence “If isis starts attacking israel, that does not mean you need to support isis…” is a bad response
This is you “so what if hypothetically Putin solves world hunger, homelessness, and redistributed all wealth so everyone was on equal playing field. Oh, oh. And he disarmed all their nukes and led the disarmament of all nuclear armed nations? Oh AND He helped solved climate change? Then would think he’s a good guy?” Like those hypotheticals are bonkers and useless.
it’s called a thought experiment
do i think anybody is realistically going to kidnap me and plumb my kidneys into a world famous violinist? no. but i can still use that hypothetical to make a point. do i think anybody is likely to run into a barn at 0.9c while holding a long ladder? no, but i can still use that to learn something.
based on your response, i presume you agree that a group can do bad things, or even be on the whole bad by a very wide margin, but still do something good worthy of praise?
Yeah but being bad and doing a good thing from time to time doesn’t make you good. Your thought experiment doesn’t provide any value because no one is saying everything the bad groups do is always and forever bad. It’s more like the severity of badness outweighs any good they are doing when it comes to the perception of them.
I’m sure Hitler gave his friends very nice and thoughtful presents. At the same time he was ordering a genocide. Are those presents then bad? Not on the surface. Is he redeemable because of that? No.
Yeah but being bad and doing a good thing from time to time doesn’t make you good.
sure, and i’m not saying that the hypothetical would make isis good
i’m saying that it would make fantasy isis worthy of praise for this specific hypothetical achievement
Idek the historical context or anything that’s going on in this situation right now, but your inability to see nuance and your insistent strawman is telling and exhausting.
False
Go on, then, which part was false? Explain it slowly.
I just want to oppose Israeli genocide without saying that the “A Curse Upon The Jews” folks targeting random countries’ civilian shipping are kosher (ha) because they said they’re doing it for A Really Good Cause, Promise™, despite the utter lack of apparent effect on that cause, and dubious mechanisms for even its theoretical effect on that cause.
Israeli genocide? Or the Houthis having “A Curse Upon The Jews” on their flag?
The Houthis thing. The Israeli genocide is fairly straight forward to understand.
Bonus: Apple spellcheck does its damnedest to not acknowledge the genocide. Someone should have words with Tim Apple.
They’re a very ‘colorful’ bunch.
God is the Greatest
Death to America
Death to Israel
A Curse Upon the Jews
Victory to Islam
Yay. More religious wing nuts. Just what we need more of these days. 🙄
2/5, try again.
What does this mean
There’s 5 points, I support 2 of them.
Works on mine.
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Campism is a hell of a drug
Comments removed for trolling…… on a meme sub.
That’s novel.
Alrighty. I’ll bite. Link me to a source.
Just scroll down bro. They’re here.
Scroll the whole thread before I commented. Have any shown up in the last two hours?
Edit: No, or they are from users on a blocked instance? Can someone link them here?
Ah yes…
I am very disturbed by mean words on a flag and a naval blockade in protest to an ongoing genocide.
Hmmm
Clearly this is a full on commitment to the cause of the houthis /s
Dang, never mind about scrolling down, just find a mirror.
Zing! Yah got me I guess… No… wait… I didn’t say shit about supporting houthis.
How very predictable that you regard downplaying atrocities from an insanely bigoted and oppressive government as ‘mean words on a flag’ as unexceptional.
Very predictable that you read that as a full on commitment by “leftists” to support maritime terrorism.
So we’ve got one comment, from one rando on the internet… And that was enough to go make this shitass meme.
I thought there would be something more substantial, like a Bernie Sanders staffer’s sister’s tweet or something.
So we’ve got one comment, from one rando on the internet… And that was enough to go make this shitass meme.
I could spend all day grabbing examples, but I know it wouldn’t matter to you. :)
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Yeah those guys are weird. Almost as weird as the “progressive except for Palestine” crowd.
Edit: actually, exactly like that crowd. Both are making exceptions to their progressivism for Palestine. Only some do it in a pro-Israeli and some in an anti-Israeli way. “Except for Palestine” both ways.
Ideology aside, as geopolitical players they do kinda fuck compared to their peers. Constantly underestimated.
Fucking psychopaths would see the Palestinian laborer crushed under the boot of theocracy purely because “they shoot at jews sometimes tho.”
One can do a good action and a bad action at the same time. They can support a national liberation struggle and oppress their citizens at the same time. I don’t know why you’d have to make a final verdict, countries are not people you should hang out with. They are bureaucratic entities with interests that are a lot of the times opposite to those of the people. How about all counties are bad?
Also I don’t understand why you would hold the poorest country in the world that was facing a genocide and the worst humanitarian crisis in earth 5-10 years ago by the Saudis and the US to the same social standards as the West. These people are hungry, poor, destroyed in every way and up until recently had to fight to gain their independence. Who do you expect to rule except for these Houthi fighters? If the west and the Saudis had let them live, then we could talk. I see this stupid take so often like with Afghanistan, it’s frustrating.
Who do you expect to rule except for these Houthi fighters?
Holy fucking shit, please look into the history of the Yemeni Civil War. The idea of the Houthis as fighting for the independence of the Yemeni people is beyond absurd.
That’s some “Who do you expect to rule except the Taliban” level take-
I see this stupid take so often like with Afghanistan, it’s frustrating.
… of course.
So treating women like humans is optional for you. Got it.
Once you realize that the reason they are not treating women equal is because they’ve been uneducated and starved to death by imperial powers to reach the point to have this government, and not because they are stupid or something, then we can talk. Oh and once you learn to read how I never said it’s acceptable, but rather that we can applaud them for one thing and condemn them for another.
If you let them live for a couple of decades they will sort it out is the main idea.
Hey, just maybe they are uneducated and starved nearly to death by imperial powers and also absolute motherfuckers. Sounds like that.
Once you realize that the reason they are not treating women equal is because they’ve been uneducated and starved to death by imperial powers to reach the point to have this government
It’s incredibly racist how you assume no agency on the part of anyone who isn’t white. But that seems to be par for the course for a certain section of the online left.
You are literally twisting my words to the point it is disgusting. I said the exact opposite, this is so toxic or your reading comprehension is very bad.
It’s insane how Americans who wanted every Arab dead since the 90s suddenly want to moralize
It’s insane how people lecturing others about how “the lesser evil is still evil, and evil is unacceptable” are going all in to lick the boots of a bigoted fascist theocracy that rules over its stretch of Yemen by naked force for attacking civilians unrelated to the cause they’re supposedly supporting.
what’s your position on western sanctions on russia? innocent russians have definitely died as a result of the sanctions
do you agree with the notion of a blockade but not with the specific group doing it? can an action be bad solely because of the party that’s enacting it?
what’s your position on western sanctions on russia?
My position is that intentionally attacking civilians with military force is indefensible. I don’t know why that’s suddenly popular on some corners of the online left.
do you agree with the notion of a blockade but not with the specific group doing it?
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I dispute that the Houthis are genuinely attempting to blockade Israel
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I dispute that, even if they were, that their actions constitute in any way a viable way to blockade Israel
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I dispute that, even if their blockade was successful, that it would meaningfully impact Israel’s ongoing genocide, considering that most trade that passes through the area isn’t going to Israel, and that the amount of trade that does pass through to Israel through Eilat is not nearly significant enough to damage their ongoing efforts, which are not exactly stymied by a lack of cars from China or a lack of diamonds from India.
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I dispute that attacking civilians, a war crime, is morally acceptable. There are laws in the modern day, it’s not the fucking Bronze Age.
I dispute that, even if they were, that their actions constitute in any way a viable way to blockade Israel
so their actions are bad because you don’t think they’ll be effective? honestly, pressuring global trade has historically been a pretty good way of achieving goals in capitalism
I dispute that attacking civilians, a war crime, is morally acceptable.
again, sanctions on russia have definitely killed people
so you’re fine with people dying, just so long as they do it from freezing to death in their homes rather than by direct military action?
so their actions are bad because you don’t think they’ll be effective? honestly, pressuring global trade has historically been a pretty good way of achieving goals in capitalism
Thanks for giving up the game and admitting that you support this not because it blockades under 10% of Israel’s trade, but because it disrupts non-Israeli trade.
again, sanctions on russia have definitely killed people
I’m sorry that the words ‘attack’ and ‘war crime’ mean nothing to you.
because it disrupts non-Israeli trade
so, just to set a baseline here, are we agreed that
- what israel is doing is bad
- stopping israel from doing what they’re doing is good
- stopping israeli trade might stop what they’re doing
- therefore stopping israel from trading is good
given that trade is definitionally between two separate parties, one of the countries in the equation has to not be israel
how can you stop israel from trading without impacting other countries?
tldr: the sanctions on russia also have an impact on global trade, so if this is your redline, you should be anti-sanctions
I’m sorry that the words ‘attack’ and ‘war crime’ mean nothing to you.
are you saying the blockade is different to sanctions because russia attacked ukraine and is committing war crimes?
i’m not sure if you’ve paid attention to things in israel recently
how can you stop israel from trading without impacting other countries?
tldr: the sanctions on russia also have an impact on global trade, so if this is your redline, you should be anti-sanctions
A desperate backtrack after giving up the game. Sorry that “Let’s hurt trade between everyone we can, not just those trading with Israel” isn’t what most people would regard as just.
are you saying the blockade is different to sanctions because russia attacked ukraine and is committing war crimes?
Brush up on your English.
fucking christ can you stop wanking yourself off with rhetoric for 5 minutes and actually address something i’m saying? ta
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Enforcing a punitive economic strategy isn’t the same as engaging in glorified pirate terrorism because Iran told you to but you totally insist it’s for palestinian liberation toats mcgoats my dudes!
Speaking as a Palestinian, fuck the houthis and their opportunistic bullshit with a hot iron.
Sanctions are not a blockade. Sanctions would be the Houthis stopping all of their own trade with Israel for example. The Houthis blockading Israel mesns they try to stop everybody from trading with Israel by force. Hence a blockade is an act of war.
And no I do not believe somebody being vegan is an act of war.
Hence a blockade is an act of war.
but we’re not talking about something being an act of war
we’re talking about whether it’s morally justifiable
are you saying any offensive war is automatically unjustifiable?
Right now the Houthis in practise blockade the Bab-el-Mandeb for everybody. The first ship they sunk Rubymar, was Belize flagged and Lebanese operated and ultimatly owned. It also caused a massive enviromental disaster in the region, due to carrying fertilizer.
What I am saying, is that an act of war against Lebanon, is not a moral response to actions of the state of Israel.
However you clearly disagree with that and consider any and all action justified as long as somebody labels them anti Israel.
presumably if somebody’s shipping weapons to israel, you’d be fine with the houthis sinking that ship? so you don’t disagree with the blockade in principle, you just think it’s being implemented too strictly?
Yes, if the Houthis would act differently, I would judge them differently.
But they do not.
how much restraint is appropriate when their stated goal is ending a genocide?
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“Israel is genociding Palestine! Obviously, this means that we MUST kill Filipino civilian sailors on a Greek boat going to Saudi Arabia to stop Israel!”
Brilliant. Have fun with that.
I will.
It small beer next to ghoulish memeing while Israel is 50000 murders into genocide and is doubling down and escalating while you fuck about in photoshop for upvotes .
It small beer next to ghoulish memeing while Israel is 50000 murders into genocide and is doubling down and escalating while you fuck about in photoshop for upvotes .
I’m sorry, I’ll limp my crippled ass to Yemen and volunteer to murder civilians for the Houthis instead of posting a meme.
You’re a god damned hero o7
It ain’t ghoulish to point out that theocrats aren’t part of liberation you fucking twat.
“Critical support to the spanish inquisition in their struggle against wester imperialism!”
That’s you, that’s what you’re trying to do whenever you try to act like the houthis deserve anything but to get shit on for what they’ve done to their own people, nevermind the civilians they’re murdering for happening to be in the region.
The mind is boggled. Has the word genocide lost all meaning ?
If it has then it’s largely your fault.
Wel thanks very much but modesty prevents me from taking all the credit.
I am very disturbed by mean words on a flag and a naval blockade in protest to an ongoing genocide.
Hmmm
“Naval blockade” here meaning “attacking random civilian ships in international waters because they MIGHT be Jews”
Yes, I am sure this is how a naval blockade against a particular country works, you just pick a handful of civilian ships at random to shoot at and claim they were secretly part of your enemies. War crimes are okay when it’s Your Side (and apparently, your side is the Islamofascists, very curious)
EDIT: Of course, they’re a Tiananmen Square denier too. How predictable.
Doing more to stop a genocide than the western powers sending weapons.
How many war crimes on balance?
Being against Israel is not the one and only measure for whether a group is good or not
Stop doing a genocide.
Stop blockading the genociders!
You first.
Stop blockading the genociders!
Yes, the genociders like [checks notes] Greece, China, and India.
Maybe if you attack enough civilians, you’ll accidentally hit some Israelis. Keep going!
So how many innocent blockade runners have died vs innocent civilians been genocided?
So how many innocent blockade runners have died vs innocent civilians been genocided?
I guess “Intentionally targeting civilians and committing war crimes is bad” sounds like radical shitlib stuff to you, as long as the people you claim to oppose (but are targeting and killing people entirely unrelated to them) are committing more war crimes.
Doing more to stop a genocide than the western powers sending weapons.
“By killing Fillipino civilian sailors heading to Saudi Arabia, this will finally stop the genocide of Palestinians by Israel!”
Have fun with your war crimes.
How many war crimes on balance?
‘on balance’?
What, is this some kind of fucking game to you? “They committed war crimes, so we can commit so war crimes too”? Jesus fucking Christ. How utterly morally bankrupt.
So one vs 42,000 and counting. Quite logical.
Somebody killing people doesn’t give you a right to kill random unrelated people, just because you are killing fewer people
Murdering civilians intentionally is inexcusable regardless of how many.
By your logic literally every genocide the US supported and engaged in would have been completely excused had they just struck the right KD ratio by throwing their death row inmates at the enemy first.
“Whoever commits fewer war crimes is moral and whatever war crimes they did were good and justified.” Quite logical.
https://mediabiasfactcheck.com/middle-east-monitor/
Your source is shit and so are theirs.
Bending over backwards to support theocrats is not revolutionary praxis, it’s licking the boot that belongs to whoever you like more.
Murdering filipinos to upset the israelis. Yes, totally a naval blockade and not just unhinged terrorism.
