You know what these things are. You were arguing for authoritarianism when you said you were in support of China, for being a, so-called, socialist state working within their means. Being in direct support of authoritarian states is an argument for their practice.
Yes, everyone on the left, who disagrees with another leftist, simply misunderstands theory, and needs to go back to their Marx. The far left and the far right want very different things, but if you want to achieve these goals through force, and sustain it by the exertion of authority, you are just a tyrant. Tyrants can be very different, but none are good. While the far left can include things that aren’t authoritarian, the far right, ultimately, can not. Even right wing versions of anarchy are, very obviously, just a vacuum of power for corporations to take.
If you don’t understand how getting people, especially politicians, to change their vote, and introduce new legislation, evokes systemic change, I don’t know what to tell you. Do you think these few examples are all I think needs to be done, ever, to achieve my goals? I figured people are capable of understanding that what they were reading was a short internet comment, and that what was presented was merely a couple examples for the point of illustration. Not a granular text on everything that I am doing, have done, or feel needs to be done, to accomplish long term goals of societal change. If that’s what you want, I am not the person for you. This is lemmy, I am typing this on the bus, or while taking shit, etc. I am not presenting my thesis to an academic council, I am not submitting these comments for peer review.
So, tell me, what are your plans? What is your proposed methodology?
You know what these things are. You were arguing for authoritarianism when you said you were in support of China, for being a, so-called, socialist state working within their means. Being in direct support of authoritarian states is an argument for their practice.
I’d like to see a link to the comment where I said that, specifically. I think you’re mixing me up with someone else, here. I personally believe China is a mixed bag, a lot of good and a lot of bad, but it does appear to be on a positive trajectory. Does that mean I support every aspect of China? No. Do you support the genocide supported by the US? I don’t believe so either.
So no, I legtimately have no idea what you personally mean.
Yes, everyone on the left, who disagrees with another leftist, simply misunderstands theory, and needs to go back to their Marx. The far left and the far right want very different things, but if you want to achieve these goals through force, and sustain it by the exertion of authority, you are just a tyrant. Tyrants can be very different, but none are good. While the far left can include things that aren’t authoritarian, the far right, ultimately, can not. Even right wing versions of anarchy are, very obviously, just a vacuum of power for corporations to take.
Are all revolutions “tyranny?” Do you believe the Haitian Slave Revolt to have been unjust? The fact of the matter is that political power stems from force. The Status Quo itself is violent, and depends on Imperialism. Using force against it is not antidemocratic.
If you don’t understand how getting people, especially politicians, to change their vote, and introduce new legislation, evokes systemic change, I don’t know what to tell you. Do you think these few examples are all I think needs to be done, ever, to achieve my goals? I figured people are capable of understanding that what they were reading was a short internet comment, and that what was presented was merely a couple examples for the point of illustration. Not a granular text on everything that I am doing, have done, or feel needs to be done, to accomplish long term goals of societal change. If that’s what you want, I am not the person for you. This is lemmy, I am typing this on the bus, or while taking shit, etc. I am not presenting my thesis to an academic council, I am not submitting these comments for peer review.
You’re arguing for everyone to ask nicely and lobby local officials. This does get positive change locally, but not in total. It’s important to recognize that at a systemic level, you are working against the prison industrial complex, pharmaceutical industry, and powerful Capitalists, and expecting politicians to bend to your will over theirs at a systemic level is Utopianism. It’s the same problem the Owenites faced.
So, tell me, what are your plans? What is your proposed methodology?
Organizing and building up Dual Power. Parallel structures that upset the power balance of the general system, not work within it where the playing field is stacked against you.
No, not every revolution is bad. Violence is not always bad. Things are, however, moving in the direction I want. I don’t expect to have a laterally managed society within my life time, and I don’t believe that murdering people, because I assert I am right, is good. Every time this is brought up the slave revolts of Haiti, the French revolution, etc. are the immediate response. Please, tell me that you believe the conditions I am in are validly comparable to those. Fact is, I am armed, I have a good understanding of my arms, and I have practice with them. I also would never claim to be able to deal with a civil war scenario, I won’t know how I will do with that until it happens. Also, the results of those revolutions is arguable with whether or not it actually made things better. In France they went into the terrors, to a marshal empire, then the changes that had been working in the background, since before the revolution, are what lead to the freedom from Monarchy. Things like the massive change in economic politics, infrastructure technology, etc. are what really allowed them to cut the autocracy off. With Haiti, while I am sure gains in ethnic autonomy are nice, it’s not exactly been the greatest thing either. And yes, I am aware of foreign interference, especially the US, etc. and how that all plays into it. Do I think it was worth it? With this one, yes, my personal opinion is yes. Then again, I value that type of autonomy over most things. There are many that disagree to some degree, or another.
On your point with China, fair enough. I read into it as you thinking I was a supporter of the capitalist system, just some liberal, I guess. Taking that I was mirroring the concept that if I preferred the system I was in, thus I was supporting it, then your endorsement of China was a sentiment of support for that system. I still don’t agree with you, but that’s whatever.
I am not arguing for everyone to ask nicely for compliance. I am saying that things are slowly going towards the things I want by means of political activism, and putting your money were your mouth is. If this comes to a impasse, that will be the time for violence. If the regressives do take the government, violence. However I am not a Haitian slave. I am acutely aware of how these industries work. I have nearly a decade of professional expertise in analyzing the corrections system. I have worked with politicians, in back office situations, on these things. We moved one of the largest state, and local, corrections systems to a far more rehabilitation, record ablative, and recidivism reductionist, state of affairs. I have worked, voluntarily, to make several changes in legislation, around healthcare, in two states. I was born with some serious medical issues, ones that cause nebulous issues, but the kind where idiots still like think “oh it can’t be that bad!” bullshit. So I have a personal stake in this, and I have used my experience with analysis, and presenting it to government reps, and moving them to my side. I am no expert, really, though I guess the stuff I was specifically doing for the DOC is expertise… The largest blockade to this change has not been the politicians, or the corporations, or the judges, DAs, or police unions. It is the general population. There is a significant amount of the population that gets a vicarious sexual-like response to seeing “others” “get what is coming to them”. This constituency is more likely to vote than the general population, so they get placated, otherwise it is more difficult to get re-elected. This sentiment has lost a lot of ground once the drug epidemic hit the middle to upper class, white, population. A lot changed when it came to the incarceration of white kids, from well to do families. Reasoning sucks, just more racism/classism, but the results are genuinely making things better.
So, what are your plans to create this parallel system you will disrupt society with? What are you currently doing to create this?
My point is that these incremental local changes cannot scale to a national level, and as Capitalism decays, fascism rises unless Leftists organize.
So, what are your plans to create this parallel system you will disrupt society with? What are you currently doing to create this?
Join an org and help build up an alternative. I am shopping around for good, non-problematic local branches of national orgs, which is difficult, plus I do not want to risk my job finding out I am a member of a Communist group, so privacy and security is an extreme concern of mine, or else I lose my income. The going is slow personally in this direction.
You know what these things are. You were arguing for authoritarianism when you said you were in support of China, for being a, so-called, socialist state working within their means. Being in direct support of authoritarian states is an argument for their practice.
Yes, everyone on the left, who disagrees with another leftist, simply misunderstands theory, and needs to go back to their Marx. The far left and the far right want very different things, but if you want to achieve these goals through force, and sustain it by the exertion of authority, you are just a tyrant. Tyrants can be very different, but none are good. While the far left can include things that aren’t authoritarian, the far right, ultimately, can not. Even right wing versions of anarchy are, very obviously, just a vacuum of power for corporations to take.
If you don’t understand how getting people, especially politicians, to change their vote, and introduce new legislation, evokes systemic change, I don’t know what to tell you. Do you think these few examples are all I think needs to be done, ever, to achieve my goals? I figured people are capable of understanding that what they were reading was a short internet comment, and that what was presented was merely a couple examples for the point of illustration. Not a granular text on everything that I am doing, have done, or feel needs to be done, to accomplish long term goals of societal change. If that’s what you want, I am not the person for you. This is lemmy, I am typing this on the bus, or while taking shit, etc. I am not presenting my thesis to an academic council, I am not submitting these comments for peer review.
So, tell me, what are your plans? What is your proposed methodology?
I’d like to see a link to the comment where I said that, specifically. I think you’re mixing me up with someone else, here. I personally believe China is a mixed bag, a lot of good and a lot of bad, but it does appear to be on a positive trajectory. Does that mean I support every aspect of China? No. Do you support the genocide supported by the US? I don’t believe so either.
So no, I legtimately have no idea what you personally mean.
Are all revolutions “tyranny?” Do you believe the Haitian Slave Revolt to have been unjust? The fact of the matter is that political power stems from force. The Status Quo itself is violent, and depends on Imperialism. Using force against it is not antidemocratic.
You’re arguing for everyone to ask nicely and lobby local officials. This does get positive change locally, but not in total. It’s important to recognize that at a systemic level, you are working against the prison industrial complex, pharmaceutical industry, and powerful Capitalists, and expecting politicians to bend to your will over theirs at a systemic level is Utopianism. It’s the same problem the Owenites faced.
Organizing and building up Dual Power. Parallel structures that upset the power balance of the general system, not work within it where the playing field is stacked against you.
No, not every revolution is bad. Violence is not always bad. Things are, however, moving in the direction I want. I don’t expect to have a laterally managed society within my life time, and I don’t believe that murdering people, because I assert I am right, is good. Every time this is brought up the slave revolts of Haiti, the French revolution, etc. are the immediate response. Please, tell me that you believe the conditions I am in are validly comparable to those. Fact is, I am armed, I have a good understanding of my arms, and I have practice with them. I also would never claim to be able to deal with a civil war scenario, I won’t know how I will do with that until it happens. Also, the results of those revolutions is arguable with whether or not it actually made things better. In France they went into the terrors, to a marshal empire, then the changes that had been working in the background, since before the revolution, are what lead to the freedom from Monarchy. Things like the massive change in economic politics, infrastructure technology, etc. are what really allowed them to cut the autocracy off. With Haiti, while I am sure gains in ethnic autonomy are nice, it’s not exactly been the greatest thing either. And yes, I am aware of foreign interference, especially the US, etc. and how that all plays into it. Do I think it was worth it? With this one, yes, my personal opinion is yes. Then again, I value that type of autonomy over most things. There are many that disagree to some degree, or another.
On your point with China, fair enough. I read into it as you thinking I was a supporter of the capitalist system, just some liberal, I guess. Taking that I was mirroring the concept that if I preferred the system I was in, thus I was supporting it, then your endorsement of China was a sentiment of support for that system. I still don’t agree with you, but that’s whatever.
I am not arguing for everyone to ask nicely for compliance. I am saying that things are slowly going towards the things I want by means of political activism, and putting your money were your mouth is. If this comes to a impasse, that will be the time for violence. If the regressives do take the government, violence. However I am not a Haitian slave. I am acutely aware of how these industries work. I have nearly a decade of professional expertise in analyzing the corrections system. I have worked with politicians, in back office situations, on these things. We moved one of the largest state, and local, corrections systems to a far more rehabilitation, record ablative, and recidivism reductionist, state of affairs. I have worked, voluntarily, to make several changes in legislation, around healthcare, in two states. I was born with some serious medical issues, ones that cause nebulous issues, but the kind where idiots still like think “oh it can’t be that bad!” bullshit. So I have a personal stake in this, and I have used my experience with analysis, and presenting it to government reps, and moving them to my side. I am no expert, really, though I guess the stuff I was specifically doing for the DOC is expertise… The largest blockade to this change has not been the politicians, or the corporations, or the judges, DAs, or police unions. It is the general population. There is a significant amount of the population that gets a vicarious sexual-like response to seeing “others” “get what is coming to them”. This constituency is more likely to vote than the general population, so they get placated, otherwise it is more difficult to get re-elected. This sentiment has lost a lot of ground once the drug epidemic hit the middle to upper class, white, population. A lot changed when it came to the incarceration of white kids, from well to do families. Reasoning sucks, just more racism/classism, but the results are genuinely making things better.
So, what are your plans to create this parallel system you will disrupt society with? What are you currently doing to create this?
My point is that these incremental local changes cannot scale to a national level, and as Capitalism decays, fascism rises unless Leftists organize.
Join an org and help build up an alternative. I am shopping around for good, non-problematic local branches of national orgs, which is difficult, plus I do not want to risk my job finding out I am a member of a Communist group, so privacy and security is an extreme concern of mine, or else I lose my income. The going is slow personally in this direction.