• topeconhilo@lemmy.worldOP
    link
    fedilink
    English
    arrow-up
    42
    arrow-down
    3
    ·
    edit-2
    1 year ago

    After application of penalties, the final classification order is:

    1. Verstappen
    2. Leclerc
    3. Pérez
    4. Norris (+1)
    5. Alonso (+1)
    6. Sainz (-2)
    7. Russell (+1)
    8. Hamilton (-1)
    9. Stroll (+1)
    10. Gasly (-1)
    11. Albon
    12. Zhou (+2)
    13. Sargeant
    14. Ocon (-2)
    15. Bottas (+1)
    16. Piastri (+1)
    17. De Vries (-2)
    18. Magnussen (+1)
    19. Tsunoda (-1)

    DNF. Hulkenberg

    • buckaroo_banzai@lemmy.ca
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      20
      ·
      1 year ago

      That’s a lot of change. They need to figure something out for the future here as this is just ridiculous

      • milk@lemmy.fmhy.ml
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        18
        arrow-down
        1
        ·
        1 year ago

        Frankly, they need to figure out something the penalties situation in general. Applying a penalty after the race is finished and they can’t do anything about it is bs. It needs to happen in real time or, at least, during the race

        • gbx@sh.itjust.works
          link
          fedilink
          English
          arrow-up
          5
          arrow-down
          1
          ·
          1 year ago

          That would just be a monumental undertaking.

          They were handing them out during the race but since there were so many and it was constantly happening, there is just no way to hand them out all during the race.

          They have to examine each infringement individually and confirm it from multiple angles before making a decision. They don’t hand them out just because a driver from their point of view says the car ahead went off.

          In this very instance, it’s up to the team and the driver to make sure they stay within track limits or they face the risk of being penalised and dropped down after the race. For once, I don’t see much fault from Race Directors or the stewards side.

          As far as I know, teams can still dispute any penalty, but there is not much point in this situation and FIA can’t just hire 150 stewards to each race JUST IN CASE a massive backlog of infringements like this happens again.

        • tom@lemmy.fmhy.ml
          link
          fedilink
          English
          arrow-up
          4
          arrow-down
          1
          ·
          1 year ago

          I mean, the thing they can do in real time is not routinely go off the track. And if that means fucking up a lap and going slow, then that driver has to accept that they can’t drive quite as fast on this track. If they want to build a new track that’s a couple feet wider on a few corners, go for it - but it wouldn’t be the Redbull Ring. Here, in Austria, you have to go at a speed at which you can stay in between the white lines. Some managed it. No sympathy for those who didn’t, it’s either a choice or a skill issue, neither of which I mind penalising.

          • bug@lemmy.one
            link
            fedilink
            English
            arrow-up
            2
            ·
            1 year ago

            Could they just put a gravel trap there instead of a run-off area?

            • Knuschberkeks@feddit.de
              link
              fedilink
              English
              arrow-up
              2
              ·
              1 year ago

              gravel traps are dangerous. They tend to flip over cars if they go sideways into them at a higher speed. Also you have to consider that the RB-Ring also hosts motorcycle races, where gravel traps pose a significant dranger even when just going wide. Also also cars tend to bring back gravel onto the track when making it out of gravel traps, which often require safety cars and disrupting the race.

              • bug@lemmy.one
                link
                fedilink
                English
                arrow-up
                1
                ·
                1 year ago

                Fair point, maybe grass (or some kind of carbon fibre F1-spec AstroTurf!) or something else that provides worse grip without the danger?

                • Knuschberkeks@feddit.de
                  link
                  fedilink
                  English
                  arrow-up
                  2
                  ·
                  1 year ago

                  grass is a bit better, but has it’s own set of problems. It’s expensive to maintain, and it gets slippery when wet, so it can’t stop an out of control car in the rain. My favourite solution would be to have a strip of grass about a cars width right next to the track, followed by an astroturf runoff.

          • Serinus
            link
            fedilink
            English
            arrow-up
            1
            ·
            1 year ago

            It was a choice. They took the risk that it wouldn’t be penalized, because it probably wouldn’t be.

            Showing that it’ll be enforced changes the math for next time.

    • Matte@feddit.it
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      7
      arrow-down
      1
      ·
      1 year ago

      this is honestly ridiculous. both for the drivers, who can’t keep the car on track, and for the F1 in general.

      and what’s up with perez and hamilton claiming he was constantly out?? did FIA just… “forget” about him?

        • ApexHunter
          link
          fedilink
          English
          arrow-up
          5
          arrow-down
          2
          ·
          1 year ago

          It was pretty clear even from the TV feeds that both of them were going off quite a bit (PER more than NOR, but both too much to ignore).

          • Omgarm@lemmy.world
            link
            fedilink
            English
            arrow-up
            1
            ·
            1 year ago

            It takes a certain amount of times going off before you get a warning and then some more before a penalty is applied.

  • fiah@discuss.tchncs.de
    link
    fedilink
    English
    arrow-up
    10
    ·
    1 year ago

    this is nuts, how hard is it to mount 4 extra cameras that do nothing but check whether the 4 tires are beyond the white lines? They already have cameras and sensors galore, adding 4 more so that the drivers, teams and stewards get instant feedback should be possible

    • Barbarian772@feddit.de
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      3
      arrow-down
      1
      ·
      1 year ago

      How hard is it to simply use the curbs as they did before. Imo doing it like this just makes the racing worse without any actual benefit.

      • hglman
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        6
        ·
        1 year ago

        Curbs hurt people, saftey does matter.

        • Sentau@lemmy.one
          link
          fedilink
          English
          arrow-up
          1
          ·
          1 year ago

          The white lines are virtually impossible to see from the cockpit while the curbs are easier to see and hence it is easier to judge the position of the car with respect to the curb. Also the putting all 4 wheels on the curb is generally slower than staying on the road so the drivers have have incentive to not cross the curb. This will both limit the number of track limit violations and make the job for both the drivers and race control easier

          • actually_a_tomato@lemm.ee
            link
            fedilink
            English
            arrow-up
            1
            ·
            1 year ago

            I can see the logic in what you’re saying, but my concern is that using the curbs leaves things too open to interpretation to be consistent. Curbs aren’t on all parts of the track, and they aren’t the same across all tracks.

            Really, the issue of exceeding the white line isn’t a rules issue, it’s a team issue. The teams build and operate their cars around a huge number of regulations. They’ve simply decided that this one doesn’t have enough of an impact to warrant the investment. More races like Austria and they might start to take track limits seriously.

            Or, this is a problem specific to the Red Bull Ring and modifying the track will prevent it from reoccuring. I don’t recall this frequency of penalties occuring on other tracks this year.

            • Sentau@lemmy.one
              link
              fedilink
              English
              arrow-up
              1
              ·
              1 year ago

              Considering the teams have regulations on the size of the car and in a ground effect era the cars have to be as low as possible, so I don’t see how teams can improve the white line visibility situation

              • actually_a_tomato@lemm.ee
                link
                fedilink
                English
                arrow-up
                1
                ·
                1 year ago

                The cars “have to be as low as possible” just like they “have to stay within track limits”. The reason ride hight is prioritized over visibility is because of the ROI. If penalties for exceeding track limits have enough of an impact, the teams will implement solutions.

  • itsmikeydM
    link
    fedilink
    English
    arrow-up
    11
    arrow-down
    1
    ·
    1 year ago

    I’ve been all for the track limit enforcement, and I’ve been pleased about the way it’s vern handled during Q and the race.

    For it to come to light that RC and the stewards got this so wrong is an absolute disgrace.

  • specialneedz
    link
    fedilink
    English
    arrow-up
    7
    ·
    1 year ago

    I think instead of monitoring track limits, they should just put up massive curbs / gravel / grass exactly where the car would be if it went 1cm past track limits. It would stop people taking the piss, stop the stupid penalties, and also make things more exciting when someone did go to far with them then disadvantaged for a straight etc.

    • Octavius@lemmy.world
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      6
      arrow-down
      1
      ·
      1 year ago

      Well the issue here might be that this creates a new safety issue as more or less seen when Hamilton and verstappen stacked on each other. I don’t know why they are enforcing these limits. If it’s enforced for nobody there is no unfair advantage to be gained

      • Lzwzli@reddthat.com
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        3
        ·
        1 year ago

        I don’t think grass or gravel will cause safety issue in the event of an accident. Kerbs yes.

    • Barbarian772@feddit.de
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      4
      arrow-down
      1
      ·
      1 year ago

      Or simply use the curb and not the white line as a track limit. The white line is impossible to see from the drivers perspective. At least they can feel the curb.

      • _ed@sopuli.xyz
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        1
        ·
        edit-2
        1 year ago

        Gravel seems like a good option, not sure how it would affect other motorsports though.

        • Barbarian772@feddit.de
          link
          fedilink
          English
          arrow-up
          2
          ·
          1 year ago

          I would prefer gravel too, i think it’s very dangerous for the bikes though which sucks for tracks like Austria which are hosting Moto GP and F1.

          Maybe they should simply get screens in the cars or helmets that show them the front tire position. I think it’s also weird af that they can’t automate the detecting and have to have a staff of people just looking at track limits.

      • duck_squirtle@feddit.nl
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        1
        ·
        1 year ago

        It’s very refreshing to see people realizing this more here, instead of constantly repeating this stupid argument of “they are professionals, they should know how to keep it between the lines”.

    • actually_a_tomato@lemm.ee
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      2
      ·
      1 year ago

      I think the curbs should be replaced with spike strips. That would incentivize the drivers to stay on the track.

  • datendefekt
    link
    fedilink
    English
    arrow-up
    2
    ·
    1 year ago

    I listened to the podcast Missed Apex, and Spanners suggested so often that the just install sensors that notice of you’re off track. And if they do, reduce power output by a bit. The technology is there, and the instant feedback would prevent this kind of mess.

  • picklestehbutt@lemmy.world
    link
    fedilink
    English
    arrow-up
    1
    ·
    1 year ago

    In past seasons teams were complaining that track limits weren’t being enforced consistently. I guess this is what we get.