cross-posted from: https://lemmy.world/post/715287
Guess where? Unironically r/Save3rdPartyApps
The Reddit search for Lemmy also gives these privacy copy-pasta as top results when searching for Lemmy. I’m still betting that Reddit employees are involved in boosting these posts.
That’s actually hilarious. Once you analyse it, it boils down to three things:
- Ad hominem towards the devs. It’s so idiotic that I won’t waste my time with it.
- Conflation of the flagship instance (lemmy.ml) with the platform as a whole. As if you had to use lemmy.ml to use the platform (you don’t).
- Incorrectly assigning privacy concerns of social media as a whole to Lemmy in specific.
The third point actually deserves some clarification: no matter if it’s Twitter, Reddit, Facebook, Mastodon, Lemmy or any other sort of social media, you should be extra careful with what you share, as it might eventually bite you back. It is public communication, treat it as such; it is not private conversation. Regardless of Lemmy storing it or not, consider what you share publicly with the internet as potentially staying forever, and be mindful with it.
So all three points are actually invalid. This might convince some irrationals to stay clear off the platform, but frankly? This is actually good for people here.
expired
Yup - and there’s always the issue with third parties storing this info. Reddit has been archived, for example; so no matter what Reddit Inc. does with your data, it’s still “on the internet”.
I suspect they do, in fact, understand the difference. And are intentionally conflating lemmy the platform with lemmy.ml the instance in order to dissuade people from using the platform, since they know that most people new to the platform wouldn’t understand the distinction.
expired
What excactly do you mean when you say “user data” in this context?
Well, I know of an easy litmus test.
In what is known as the Tiananmen Square Massacre, or in Chinese the June Fourth (1989) Clearing or June Fourth Massacre, Chinese government troops murdered several hundred citizens and students who were protesting for freedom of speech and freedom of the press, among other things.
easy litmus test
Not a good one IMO. I don’t obviously think it will get deleted but I think that writing that on c/Technology or c/Lemmy and then complain that it gets deleted would be just a dishonest bait, because it is off-topic and should IMO get deleted from those subs, I at least would delete it and I’m as capitalistic as it gets.
A better test would be to post it on a more general or politics sub and wait and see.
It’s 100% on topic. This is THE canonical Lemmy instance and we want evidence of excessive moderation. It’s less about politics than it is about neutrality.
If it stays up, it provides evidence directly countering the accusations against the instance. If it doesn’t, I know early to not waste my time here.
Making waves just because you feel it’s your right to do so can work, but it doesn’t have to, and you can’t complain if it doesn’t. Nobody wants to have some narrative forced upon them, regardless the content.
Stick to the politics communities to post about politics, humor for humor, etc.
If that would be wrong, why would we have such things as “communities” (in the Lemmy sense) anyways?
So edgy, what a bad boy.
I’ve seen the privacy post a ton. It’s hilarious to me because there’s never any comparison to Reddit’s privacy policy.
Meanwhile everybody’s discovering how horrible Reddit is at deleting stuff.
And that’s before even getting into the fact that even IF reddit deleted it all, it’s never gonna get deleted from Pushshift or the hundreds (thousands?) of copies people have downloaded from there.
The constant politics argument is tiring. Do you know the politics of the guy who made your favorite game? What about the guy who made your text editor? Or your browser? Or the software in your microwave? Or grew your food? Or the guy who made that song you like? What about the owner of the last convenience store you bought your mtdew from?
Even if the commentary is coming from an honest point of view and not just shitty astroturfing (and it very much isn’t), it doesn’t matter. If you don’t like it, use an instance that’s not run by them and who cares.
I have never understood people’s lack of ability to just move on.
Don’t like something, like seriously just move on, don’t like a post / comment, move on rinse and repeat.
You’re not going to like everything and you’re not going to agree with everyone, and you know what… That’s alright, it’s being human !
Definition of concern trolling. As if Reddit gives a shit about your privacy either.
Reddit: You’re giving your information to strangers! You don’t know what they’ll do it with it!
Me: Weren’t you going to sell my data?
Reddit: Yeah, but that’s different! We’re a respectable adult capitalist business. These are fucking commie pinko freaks we’re talking about here!
All options that aren’t federated are just as reasonably suspect when it comes to good stewardship of your data. A federated universe means if you really are that worried about it, you can spin up your own instance and be able to trust yourself with your own data.
Also, is it really a shocker that Reddit would turn to McCarthy-era Red Scare tactics? What’s next, hiring the fucking Pinkertons like Wizards of the Coast did?
Also saying socialists are posting Nazi shit is weird. They’re, uh, not the same.
I do have concerns about this instance and Lemmy in general because of the aura of accusations, but I haven’t seen any real evidence yet.
And I wouldn’t expect to from the instance itself. If there’s heavy moderation you won’t see the dissent.
Further, even if admins are tankies…
Let’s see, which economic system has consumed the entire world? Is it communism? Because last I checked, even “communist” China has a semi-capitalist market economy. Russia is capitalist. Everywhere is capitalist.
When leftists of all stripes barely have any control of anything in the world, why the fuck would I be so worried about them and their opinions? It’s not like they’re affecting things in a big way, no, leftists are mostly silenced. Especially in the US where the right-leaning milquetoast Democrats are offered up as “the left” which is a huge fucking joke.
To quote Nancy fucking Pelosi:
“We’re capitalists, and that’s just the way it is.”
When there is a strong contingent of countries with leftist leaders emerging as strong nations that can economically compete with capitalist nations, then I’ll start to fucking worry, and that’s only if those leftists are actually violently dangerous.
Acting like the admins here on Lemmy are “dangerous” because of their political stances is the biggest fucking joke. I literally can’t take it, it’s such a fucking farce. These guys don’t control shit except their own instance of Lemmy.
Most of the comments in there are shooting him down and telling people they can join another instance if they don’t want to see the ML shit
As if Lemmy.ml is the only Lemmy exists.
It is the “default” one, though, and its admins are behind the Lemmy platform itself. Along with the Jerboa app, too.
I think lemmy.world is more the default at this point.
I wouldn’t give a shit if it was just hating Lemmy, you do you. But Lemmy has had many many incidents of people from other platforms (usually one of the 'chans) coming over to either troll or get the motivation to “convert” Lemmy users to their views (basically more trolling but with an obvious agenda). Not come over and try to debate us mind you, more like posting porn and/or gore with extremely “politically incorrect” titles and captions.
We might be in for a few more of those is what I’m saying.
… yea probably. I’d do that if I were spez. It’s a sound move from his position, surprisingly.
At least the second comment doesn’t seem to me like coming from pigboy spez or Reddit Inc., as it has links to another Reddit alternative. And it’s a lot similar in tone to things that I’ve seen before the appocalipse in r/RedditAlternatives.
I have to ask.
Is there any truth to what has been said about Lemmy’s dev ?
The devs addressed this in the post-reddit-blackout post. You are free to come to your own conclusions.
https://join-lemmy.org/news/2023-06-17_-_Update_from_Lemmy_after_the_Reddit_blackout
On another topic, there are rumors circulating that we are fascists or supported genocide. These claims are completely false, and like most viral twitter threads, are coming from a single Mastodon user on a personal vendetta who didn’t provide any sources. Such slander doesn’t deserve any response and is best left ignored. If you want to know the truth then read the following pages (both from 2021):
As you can see we are not a faceless corporation that is accomodating to everyone. We are individuals with our own opinions. If you disagree with these, it is no problem! You can still freely use the Lemmy software on different instances. If you host your own instance, we have no control over it at all and are unable to censor what users say. For more details read the documentation on censorship resistance. In practice, the instance list already contains various instances whose content would be banned from lemmy.ml immediately.
"“If you don’t agree with our opinion you can gtfo” is a concerning stance.
Would love clarification on that. I’ve been banned enough for having pretty moderate opinions in extremist subs.
I understand if they don’t want maga communities here who heavily censor (as they generally do). I hope they’re not ban happy for moderate to small differences of opinion.
For example, I think capitalism in small doses can be a good thing, similar to morphine or cocaine having legitimate medical uses. It’s the lack of controls that are the primary issue.
I don’t want to get overly invested in something if I’m just going to get banned for not being full communist.
But like I said, so far the only accusations have been extremely vague. I’m keeping an eye out and testing the waters a bit, but I’m not acting too heavily on baseless slander.
I think that’s valid, but from what I’ve seen, it mostly relates to Western propaganda against China.
I don’t trust the US or Chinese governments, really, but I can at least admit from a Western perspective, a lot of stuff promoted about China is propaganda, and I don’t disagree with the admins that it can be perceived as “racist.” I agree with the admins on that and it seems that is mostly where the accusations lie, with them supporting China. I think that’s fair and China is just as full of actual real humans (actually more) than the US and other Western nations. Painting all US citizens or all Chinese citizens with a broad brush isn’t acceptable. Valid critiques of their government should be, but a lot of Western critiques can often (and should) be dismissed as not valid, highly propagandist, or even racist.
Example: US people complaining about China’s “Social Credit Score” while having no issues with the US “Economic Credit Score” even though they achieve similar goals.
Anyway, that’s what I’ve seen. People post something that’s anti-China from a Western perspective and admins remove it.
Also, “if you don’t agree you can gtfo” is kind of the entire point of federation. You can always choose another instance that these guys don’t run. I think that’s an entirely valid attitude, and it’s one that allows the Fediverse to grow instead of stagnate on one server.
If you don’t agree with our opinion on how a server should be run. Which is very different from “if you don’t agree with our political views”. It’s not clear which they mean.
So I’m still very interested in their opinion on how a server should be run. If that’s sufficient then I shouldn’t need to be concerned with their political views.
I’ve no idea, but there’s more than one dev.
Does it actually matter though?
For me it doesn’t matter for lemmy as a whole. But if there is any truth to it, I want nothing with the instances that are administrated by these guys.
They manage lemmy.ml. As long as you are not there, they have nothing to do with you.
They’re allowed their opinions, as long as they’re not forcing them on others.
Being open to discussion works both ways. If their intention is to make an echo chamber, it won’t reach very far.
Some of the core devs, who also run lemmy.ml, are tankies. That being said, it’s an open standard and most of the popular instances are very against that mindset. The beauty and difficulty of an open, decentralized platform is that every instance can set their own ground rules and decide who to federate with.
App apocalypse… Appocalypse? Goddamn has this really been staring me in the face the whole month and I only see it now?
you sir win the internet today
is lemmy and kbin the only two federations that’s reddit-like for now?
I think Lemmy is reddit like, so any server running lemmy will be reddit like.
yes, I mean derivatives of those “softwares”–is that the right term? I mean, lemmy.ml, lemmy.world, lemmy.one for examples are servers / instances, but they’re in the same “family”, which is Lemmy. Same thing with kbin, there are kbin.social, karab.in, forum.fail are the instances of the same kbin “family”
for now I see that link aggregator & discussion model (reddit-like) “software” is Lemmy and Kbin
I wonder if there are other softwares beside those two. Though for now I think it’s… sufficient ? if the reddit post discredit lemmy, then do they provide the way to kbin instead? if not, does it matter if the admin or dev of main lemmy software and instance have differing views in life? would it affect the other lemmy servers as well?
in other words, can the main lemmy devs affect the other instances / servers due to their problematic worldview ? or will it be contained to the servers that they maintain ? How much “independence” do each of these servers have ?
It’s just software. And it’s open source. That’s about it. Don’t like the software? Fork it, or just don’t upgrade.
The Lemmy devs get no say in administration, other than the instance they run. Don’t like Lemmy.ml? Run your own. They actively encourage other communities with competing world views to do so.
The fact is that despite being openly supporting communism, the Lemmy devs have done more for the online free market in two years than the tech giants have done in decades. This speaks volumes.
I’ve been calling them “lemmyverse” (lemmy.ml, beehaw.org, etc.) and “kbinverse” (kbin.social, karab.in, etc.) respectively. Both as subsets of the fediverse.
I killed my reddit account. Done with em and not looking back.
I know it’s anecdotal (and late to this post), but I went back lurking my own profile today, and one of the arguments I had with someone regarding the API changes, and the commenter I was arguing with had about 1k more upvotes now more than 2 weeks later. It was in the middle of a conversation thread and none of the other comments in the whole post had anywhere close to that many votes.
I wouldn’t generally consider myself as someone who would suspect brigading (and honestly, i’m cool with people who dissagree with me), but I can’t think of any other reason why that comment had so many upvotes so long after the conversation took place.
I hope that site crashes and burns and I hope those VC’s loose their shirts on their IPO.
I mean those people can stay there. We don’t want them here. Like minded people will check it out and stay and the weirdos will stay on Reddit.
I’m hoping this is exactly what happens. Reddit declined once it hit a certain level of popularity, and it seems like lemmy is attracting a first wave of more level headed people. Let the crazies keep reddit, keep them contained.
