• lugal@lemmy.world
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      6 months ago

      I have an account on lemmygrad and when I created it, I was asked about my politics. They formally accepted every left ideology but when you say anything remotely anti-authoritarian, you get downvoted into oblivion

      • ManniSturgis@lemmy.zip
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        6 months ago

        Mind boggling. Like seriously, I am as left wing as they come and for me that is defined by anti-authoritarian views. Fascists aren’t bad because they are the wrong kind of fascist.

        • orrk@lemmy.world
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          6 months ago

          to be fair, tankies are the fascist skinwalkers wearing the visage of the lefties they killed

        • lugal@lemmy.world
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          6 months ago

          I totally agree with you. That said, tankies will argue some shit why they are further left. You can go into that discussion about the semantics of left and distract from the fact that tankies are evil. Or stop “gatekeeping” leftness and argue why they are bad.

        • Kedly@lemm.ee
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          6 months ago

          I’ve recently come to the conclusion that they are the leftist version of Nazi Bronies, like, dude, you’re one of the first populations that your preferred rulers are going to purge.

      • Cowbee [he/him]
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        6 months ago

        Not doubting you, but what do you mean by “anti-authouritarian?” Presumably you’ve read Engels’ On Authority so you know what they are operating under the pretense of, I can see anti-Marxist takes getting removed or downvoted. It is Lemmygrad after all, not Lemmy EZLN or Lemmy Catalonia.

        • lugal@lemmy.world
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          6 months ago

          I didn’t mean to disagree with you. Just add that they are formally open to other leftist viewpoints but not effectively.

          And yes, you will get alot of strawmans like Engels’ On Authority. If you want an analysis of the text, this video debunks it quite well

          • Cowbee [he/him]
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            6 months ago

            Are you an anti-Engels Marxist? I’m sorry, I think I actually agree with downvoting you, lol. That’s silly.

            • lugal@lemmy.world
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              6 months ago

              No, I’m not a Marxist. I agree with him in some points and agree with some libertarian Marxists but at the end, they say alot of stuff Bakunin, Kropotkin, Goldman, … said long before

              • Cowbee [he/him]
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                6 months ago

                So… why are you surprised that you get downvoted for being an Anarchist in a Marxist-Leninist space?

                • lugal@lemmy.world
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                  6 months ago

                  I’m not surprised. If anything, I was surprised to be accepted into it at the first place. Sometimes I’m surprised by the low level of education some people have. You mentioned Catalonia. Some people don’t seem to know nor want to know anything about the Spanish civil war or the anything. I sometimes try to argue with people from different ideologies because I think it’s an opportunity for all to grow and sharpen their position but I’m not surprised to be downvoted. In no comment of this thread did I express surprise

                  • orrk@lemmy.world
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                    6 months ago

                    no, the Catalonians betrayed the revolution, so they were working together with the francoists, because we need a big daddy strongman in charge!

                  • Cowbee [he/him]
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                    6 months ago

                    So then it seems like an accepting place for people to learn about Marxism-Leninism, but is primarily a space for Marxism-Leninism.

        • melpomenesclevage@lemm.ee
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          6 months ago

          Lenin had some disagreements with Marx, i dont even like marx ans lenin is worse, and ‘marxist lenninist’ means ‘stalinist’. Which is even worse. You cannot call them ‘leftists’.

          • Cowbee [he/him]
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            6 months ago

            What is a leftist, if not someone advocating collective owmership of Capital? Leftist isn’t a syononym for “good,” of course, but I fail to see how Marxist-Leninists aren’t leftists.

            • melpomenesclevage@lemm.ee
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              6 months ago

              In the USSR the serfs were still serfs even if they weren’t called that, the workers still didn’t own the means of production, and there was still a tiny room of delusional shit sticks making all the decisions, often wildly irrationally.

              Better than one guy doing it, but no more, or not much more communist than the UK or France.

              • Cowbee [he/him]
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                6 months ago

                The USSR was a Worker State, owned and run by the workers. Soviet Democracy was the base model of decision making, along the formation of Democratic Centralism.

                There were numerous struggles and issues with the USSR, of course. There was corruption, especially among the Politburo. The focus on heavy industry over light industry, though favorable during WWII, resulted in fewer luxury commodities, which resulted in liberalization and collapse.

                Fundamentally, it is entirely silly to say that the USSR wasn’t leftist. It absolutely was, even if it was highly flawed and imperfect. In fact, it’s useful to analyze what went right (free eduaction, high home ownership, generous social safety net) and what went wrong (corruption, lack of luxury commodities, etc.) so as to come up with a better system.

                That is, unless you think Marxism isn’t leftist, and think only Anarchism counts as leftist, in which case I really don’t know what to tell you.

                  • Cowbee [he/him]
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                    6 months ago

                    That’s certainly a statement, backed up by nothing but posturing and not an ounce of analysis.

                    If you can meaningfully explain how Lenin and the Bolsheviks were not Marxists, I’d be very surprised, but I am willing to hear your case. What do you believe would have been the Marxist structure? The same as the USSR, just without the corruption? Is it just vibes and aesthetics?

          • Cowbee [he/him]
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            6 months ago

            In what manner at all? Fascism is fucking horrible. I am recommending about Marx and Engels as examples of Leftists. Unless, of course, you think Communism is fascist, in which case I really don’t know what to tell you.

    • summerof69@lemm.ee
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      6 months ago

      Lemmy.ml is still focused on FOSS and Privacy

      Meanwhile at c/worldnews they remove replies where people disagree that Ukraine is run by fascists and Putin should take it.

    • Kedly@lemm.ee
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      6 months ago

      Except lemmygrad users are realizing we all blocked their instance and are becoming more active in lemmy.ml to try and evade this, and so yeah, .ml is getting more and more like Lemmygrad

      • prole@sh.itjust.works
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        6 months ago

        Can’t wait for this to become a systemic issue with Lemmy. Why does everything have to be ruined by tankies and conservatives? They know that nobody wants to talk to them, but they will evade and disrespect the rules just to make other people miserable.

        What a sad hobby.

        • Kedly@lemm.ee
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          6 months ago

          Tbh, I’m not super worried, theres already been defederation with Hexbear and Lemmygrad. As they infect tanky safezones and cause more defederations because of it, non tankie specific federations are going to start becoming specifically anti Tankie in response. I mean, look at my comment calling them brain damaged, it hasnt been civility removed yet, which I feel is a good sign. So while they can always create new accounts on non Tankie federations, over time they are going to start having to hide their more violent revolution and dictator loving sides, which tbh, at that point I’ll tolerate their presence.

          Edit: It’s kind of ironic how in a post where I called other people brain damaged, I wrote it like I was having a stroke. I’ve edited it to make it flow faaaaarrr better