and this is also why i don’t trust people who say that china is communist. in my view, communism would imply good working conditions, which i think is not the case here.
China is an exploited country. There is no progress for them without a lot of work going on. Still wages and quality of life are rising steadily. Of course it is not ideal, its a shame even. But if you want more for China we must encircle and strangle the empire. Much of the value created in China is recycled into western stock exchanges.
Let’s me more judicious with the downvotes, comrades. This seems like a good faith comment that provoked some good responses.
Part of the reason people are disagreeing here is that your statement implies a straw-man version of “communism”. There are many pre-industrial societies which might be called “communist,” but the working conditions were absolutely grueling in short spurts. Don’t fall for the trap that true Communism is utopia. This is one of the propaganda traps the reactionaries have programmed you to fall into.
but let me ask it this way: in my understanding, one reason why we organize a anticapitalist, communist/socialist movement in capitailist countries is for instance that the working conditions are bad, right? for instance the USA. or in general that the quality of life is bad in the USA.
They have poor working conditions but 90% of chinese people own a house; thats what communism looks like.
i kind of agree, but what if i would like to have good working conditions instead of owning a house? and in general quality of live to be able to think about politics?
thinking about politics, reading books, etc. is much easier with good working conditions i think.
The working conditions are better in China today than they were a generation ago. That’s is the point of socialism; progressive improvement for the workers and the society at large.
And, again, working long shifts is not inherently bad. How much time off do these workers get? Would you be willing to pull 9 hour shifts for 60 days and then have 60 days of no work at all? Sure you would. Don’t be so eager to believe a western media source criticizing Chinese workers when American workers have no healthcare, no paid family leave, no housing guarantee, etc. these American workers also tend to work long hours, or even many jobs.
yes of course, america is also very bad. But my perspective is from europe, where i think the working conditions are sometimes better.
But when i think about it: it might just be that my perspective here is biased because of privilege: i don’t see/“Experience” the miserale working conditions that much poorer people experience. So it might just be that china is more equal from worker to worker.
so yes, i probably would pull 9 hour shifts for 60 days with 60 days free times, but i think i like it better to have my free time more equally distributed, so for instance only 6 hours per day of work and less free days.
I don’t want to be a nitpicker, and I recognise that this is only a small part of your overall point, but I am curious where the 30% of .uk being homeowners number comes from, and what the methodology is.
Typically I see numbers where ~65% of households are owner-occupiers. When I go check on my friends, however, it’s more like 10%.
and this is also why i don’t trust people who say that china is communist. in my view, communism would imply good working conditions, which i think is not the case here.
It’s a bit disappointing to see this happening
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China is an exploited country. There is no progress for them without a lot of work going on. Still wages and quality of life are rising steadily. Of course it is not ideal, its a shame even. But if you want more for China we must encircle and strangle the empire. Much of the value created in China is recycled into western stock exchanges.
bruhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh
read state and revolution
Let’s me more judicious with the downvotes, comrades. This seems like a good faith comment that provoked some good responses.
Part of the reason people are disagreeing here is that your statement implies a straw-man version of “communism”. There are many pre-industrial societies which might be called “communist,” but the working conditions were absolutely grueling in short spurts. Don’t fall for the trap that true Communism is utopia. This is one of the propaganda traps the reactionaries have programmed you to fall into.
thanks for the explanation!
but let me ask it this way: in my understanding, one reason why we organize a anticapitalist, communist/socialist movement in capitailist countries is for instance that the working conditions are bad, right? for instance the USA. or in general that the quality of life is bad in the USA.
so when comrade @nervvves@lemmygrad.ml said:
i kind of agree, but what if i would like to have good working conditions instead of owning a house? and in general quality of live to be able to think about politics?
thinking about politics, reading books, etc. is much easier with good working conditions i think.
so this is what i don’t understand
The working conditions are better in China today than they were a generation ago. That’s is the point of socialism; progressive improvement for the workers and the society at large.
And, again, working long shifts is not inherently bad. How much time off do these workers get? Would you be willing to pull 9 hour shifts for 60 days and then have 60 days of no work at all? Sure you would. Don’t be so eager to believe a western media source criticizing Chinese workers when American workers have no healthcare, no paid family leave, no housing guarantee, etc. these American workers also tend to work long hours, or even many jobs.
yes of course, america is also very bad. But my perspective is from europe, where i think the working conditions are sometimes better.
But when i think about it: it might just be that my perspective here is biased because of privilege: i don’t see/“Experience” the miserale working conditions that much poorer people experience. So it might just be that china is more equal from worker to worker.
so yes, i probably would pull 9 hour shifts for 60 days with 60 days free times, but i think i like it better to have my free time more equally distributed, so for instance only 6 hours per day of work and less free days.
deleted by creator
I don’t want to be a nitpicker, and I recognise that this is only a small part of your overall point, but I am curious where the 30% of .uk being homeowners number comes from, and what the methodology is.
Typically I see numbers where ~65% of households are owner-occupiers. When I go check on my friends, however, it’s more like 10%.
deleted by creator
Thanks for the detailed reply, that makes perfect sense! The “owned outright” bit was the part I was missing.