🤢
This is a seriously stupid issue.
Why can’t we deal with this like twitters name change where everyone basically ignores it and just keeps calling it the same name as before?
That’s my plan. Unless I wish to mock it with a silly voice.
Because places like Google Maps have to deal with Trump’s, in my opinion, NAZI fueled legal and financial revenge pursuits.
Who cares? Just because multi-trillion dollar corporation Google has to deal with it doesn’t mean we have to play along.
The politicians and corporations can do whatever bullshit they do, but average people can also choose to ignore that crap.
At least when it comes to changing well established names. There’s other stuff that has real world consequences and that sucks, but we can at least hold the line in this case.
Denali.
Gulf of Mexico.
From now until the end of time.
Please get the Queen Charlottes to check in?
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You’re referring to this Queen Charlotte?
Yeah I mean she obviously wasn’t black or biracial in any sense of the word. Even if you simply take the speculation about her ancestry at face value, you’re talking about 15 generations removed, which equates to one of 32,768 ancestors at the same genetic distance, contributing 0.00305% of DNA apiece.
What an absurd topic of discussion.
You’re referring to this Queen Charlotte?
Yeah I mean she obviously wasn’t black or biracial in any sense of the word. Even if you simply take the speculation about her ancestry at face value, you’re talking about 15 generations removed, which equates to one of 32,768 ancestors at the same genetic distance, contributing 0.00305% of DNA apiece.
What an absurd topic of discussion
It’s weird how we got from renaming geographical areas to some tirade about ancestry and racism and somehow I’m at fault.
Were you in the same discussion as I was reading? Is this how you discuss geography ?
It’s weird how you asked me a question and immediately pivoted to some tirade about racism when I answered, without clarifying whatsoever. Thanks for nothing.
I literally googled (via duckduckgo) queen Charlotte and that was every single result on the first page. Then I looked at Wikipedia for 30 seconds and responded. Apparently math = racism? Nice.
I naturally assumed you were talking about altering historical facts to suit a contemporary narrative. But I clearly gave you too much credit, I’ll avoid making that mistake again.
Edit: aha, you were referring to this
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haida_Gwaii
Pretty obscure reference, but my fault for assuming. Instead of ignoring you like everyone else who had no idea what the hell you were talking about, I tried to roll with it and give you a response. You may want to refer to them as the Queen Charlotte Islands going forward…
Like the bean, sears tower, and Comiskey Park
Does anyone other than Trump want these names changed? Alaska spent decades trying to get the name changed to Denali.
Trump doesn’t want the names changed. His puppetmasters want something that will stay in the headlines for as long as possible.
Well the Donvict can fuck all the way off up his own ass. It’s the Gulf of Mexico, and Denali.
Complicit press bends knee.
Did you read the article? They had sound reasoning for their choices here.
Yes. I do not consider their reasoning sound.
Well, shows where AP lies.
Disappointed to say the least…
considers
I don’t know. I’d say that it’s probably pretty reasonable, if you figure what their job is – producing understandable material.
checks
In terms of authority, Denali is in the US. The federal government did the renaming from “Mount McKinley” to “Denali” in 2015. I don’t think that generally there was dispute that the federal government was the authority on the name of the thing then.
In terms of familiarity, Mount McKinley’s been known as “Mount McKinley” for quite a while; most Americans are going to know what the thing is. I hadn’t paid attention to the spat over it, and when I first heard “Denali”, thought that it was a different mountain.
So (1) the administration probably legitimately is the globally-authoritative source on the name, and (2) calling it “Mount McKinley” won’t produce confusion, even with people who would rather that it be called “Denali”.
On the other hand, the Gulf of Mexico is a major international geographical feature frequently referred to abroad. Very little of it is within US borders. Some countries are surrounded by it, and the term is frequently used abroad – as the AP mentions. It’s not very likely that any other countries are going to change their day-to-day use over it, whatever Trump says. All Americans know it as the Gulf of Mexico, and I doubt that most are going to change the term they use. So continuing to call it the “Gulf of Mexico” is probably the most-understandable approach; indicating parenthetically that it’s been designated the “Gulf of America” indicates that the official term is this, though they aren’t using it.
Like, the AP’s job isn’t “participate in a culture war on one side or another”, but “get copy out that people can understand”.
I will say, though – expanding the discussion past the AP’s decision – that while I don’t think that the AP’s stance is unreasonable…the same might not be said of the people who wanted the rename.
A major argument being made by a number of folks that support Trump that states should be given more deference and not run roughshod over by the federal government – okay, fair enough.
But the mountain is located in Alaska. It looks like Alaska prefers “Denali”, and, in fact, its lower legislative house just passed a resolution objecting to the rename:
The naming of the thing “Mount McKinley” was done to honor President McKinley. And, okay, the federal government’s gotta have something somewhere if it wants to do something like that, and good odds are that it’s in some state’s territory. But I very much suspect that of all the things that one can find in the US, it’s probably possible to find something somewhere noteworthy that could be named by the federal government to honor President McKinley without running into objections from the state.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Denali
The Alaska Board of Geographic Names changed the name of the mountain to Denali in 1975, which was how it was called locally.[11][32] However, a request in 1975 from the Alaska state legislature to the United States Board on Geographic Names to do the same at the federal level was blocked by Ohio congressman Ralph Regula, whose district included McKinley’s home town of Canton.[33]
My guess is that Ohio is probably okay with having something in its borders named after President McKinley, for example.
Good on you for doing some more research. Imo Denali and the Gulf of Mexico are like Mount Vesuvius and the Mediterranean Sea, i.e., the names are eminently suitable and essentially permanent. I’m going to expound on this at length, specifically in regard to Denali, because the case for the Gulf of Mexico is so incredibly one-sided and obvious. The case for Denali is also one-sided, but it’s much less well known.
To clarify, the name didn’t originate in honor of President McKinley, it was created while he was still running for president.
In 1896, a gold prospector named it McKinley as political support for then-presidential candidate William McKinley, who became president the following year.
In other words, the mountain which had been locally known as Denali for centuries was arbitrarily utilized as a political pawn to boost the candidacy of McKinley, who turned out to be a mediocre president at best.
Also, it wasn’t officially recognized as such until 20 years later by Democrat Woodrow Wilson, potentially as a conciliatory political maneuver towards the Republican party, which was dominant under the Fourth Party System. Little known fact, from 1869 through 1933, there were 11 Republican presidents and only 2 Democratic ones. This is somewhat misleading because Grover Cleveland was elected twice and the Republicans had a couple deaths in office, but still drives home their political dominance at the time.
Speaking of which, William McKinley was assassinated by an anarchist by the name of Leon Czolgosz, who appears to me a significantly more sympathetic figure than our contemporary Luigi, whom I personally find quite lame and reprehensible, but apparently the rest of you consider to be some kind of folk hero 🙄
A few notes about the circumstances and trial of this anarchist. See if you notice any parallels between his situation and ours.
Quotes from wikipedia
Czolgosz believed there was a great injustice in American society, an inequality which allowed the wealthy to enrich themselves by exploiting the poor. He concluded that the reason for this was the structure of government. About this time, he learned of the assassination of a leader in Europe, King Umberto I of Italy, who had been shot dead by anarchist Gaetano Bresci on July 29, 1900. Bresci told the press that he had decided to take matters into his own hands for the sake of the common man.
Lewis and his co-counsel called no witnesses, which Lewis in his closing argument attributed to Czolgosz’s refusal to cooperate with them. In his 27-minute address to the jury, Lewis took pains to praise McKinley.
Scott Miller, author of The President and the Assassin, notes that the closing argument was more calculated to defend the attorney’s “place in the community, rather than an effort to spare his client the electric chair”.
His brother asked him “Who got you into this scrape?” to which Czolgosz responded “No one. Nobody had anything to do with it but me.” His brother said it was unlike him and was not how he was raised. When asked by his brother if he wanted the priests to come back, Czolgosz said, “No, damn them. Don’t send them here again. I don’t want them,” and “Don’t you have any praying over me when I am dead. I don’t want it. I don’t want any of their damned religion.”
Czolgosz’s last words were: “I killed the President because he was the enemy of the good people – the good working people. I am not sorry for my crime. I am sorry I could not see my father.” Czolgosz was electrocuted by three jolts, each of 1,800 volts, in Auburn Prison on October 29, 1901, forty-five days after McKinley’s death.
The context which I have just provided should be reason enough to refuse the name Mount McKinley, based on the sentiments that have been superficially expressed on Lemmy and social media in general of late.
However, the fact that local Alaskans never stopped calling it Denali, and indeed successfully petitioned to have it officially renamed Denali in 1975, is even more damning. As per the Denali Wikipedia article
Indigenous names for Denali can be found in seven different Alaskan languages. The names fall into two categories. To the south of the Alaska Range in the Dena’ina and Ahtna languages the mountain is known by names that are translated as ‘big mountain’. To the north of the Alaska Range in the Lower Tanana, Koyukon, Upper Kuskokwim, Holikachuk, and Deg Xinag languages the mountain is known by names that are translated as ‘the high one’, ‘the tall one’ (Koyukon, Lower and Middle Tanana, Upper Kuskokwim, Deg Xinag, and Holikachuk).
All of these names are essentially different pronunciations of Denali
Asked about the importance of the mountain and its name, Will Mayo, former president of the Tanana Chiefs Conference, an organization that represents 42 Athabaskan tribes in the Alaskan interior, said: “It’s not one homogeneous belief structure around the mountain, but we all agree that we’re all deeply gratified by the acknowledgment of the importance of Denali to Alaska’s people.”
In conclusion, Trump can go fuck himself in his fat fucking ass.
amazing comment on a top notch thread!
But not surprised.
I think their take is pretty pragmatic. It makes sense since the AP is an American news outlet.
Lol, the most leftist news outlet. Be neutral as possible.
Law is law, until challenged by a court.That doesn’t sound very left, infact that isn’t left at all.
AP is most leftist I don’t think so
