Over the weekend, fans of Ubisoft games underwent a minor panic as a rumor spread that Ubisoft might be spontaneously deleting inactive Ubisoft accounts, permanently destroying digital game libraries if users didn't log on often enough. However, Ubisoft has now clarified that users' digital game libraries are safe.
Oh I’m sure in the ToS it mentions that we don’t own anything and they have the right to cut access whenever they want for any reason and that you can’t sue them for it
I’m not a lawyer, but I vaguely remember hearing that Terms of Service can’t protect a company from everything. I seriously doubt a company could get away with that when it was brought to court.
If I am reading this correctly which probably I am not, 10k is very little for a class action so most wouldn’t be covered at all by this restriction, it seems like a way to not have lawyers costs for very small class actions, but big ones would be “allowed”
That again… I am probably misreading it, I am not a lawyer.
You are right, you are misreading it 😎. The $10,000 is for your personal claims, not the total class action value. Moreover, class action is prohibited twice here. The first clause:
claims must be brought in the parties’ individual capacity, and not as a plaintiff or class member in any purported class or representative proceeding
Has not dollar limit. The language here is extremely confusing because of the double repetition. I can’t even tell if the arbitration is “binding” or not. I’ll assume that it is, based on the legal principle “exception that proves the rule” combined with clause 13.2 c). Here’s my not-a-lawyer flowchart interpretation consistent with every clause:
if less than $10,000 in claims (99%+ of accounts), then:
must file Notice of Dispute
then if reject settlement offer, may file Demand for Arbitration OR file in small claims court
BUT you “waive any right to a trial by judge or jury”, and a court is presided by a judge, so… no small claims court for you!
(Any actual lawyer feel free to correct me in case a small claims court trial doesn’t count as a trial by a judge)
if more than $10,000 in claims (someone who somehow bought hundreds of ubisoft games?), then:
may file Notice of Dispute or skip it
then may file Demand for Arbitration OR file in small claims court
BUT small claims court limit is typically $5000-$10000, so… no small claims court for you!
UNLESS you live in one of 8 states with a higher limit, and have a claim of exactly between $10000 and $15000
in NO CASE may you be part of class action
Also, under clause 13.3 any legal action must be adjudicated in the courts of the State of California. I don’t know if that includes small claims courts, or if there is some legal tradition that small claims can always be filed in state of residence of the consumer. California has a $10k small claims limit, so if there is no such tradition, to me it appears there are NO situations where you can file any court case, big or small, consistent with these rules.
Of course, but OP brought up that they couldn’t be sued. I was just pointing out that if someone was willing to test it, I bet they could come out on top.
Ubisoft reserves the right to terminate Ubisoft+ or any of the Ubisoft+ Services, at any time and for any reason, with at least thirty (30) day notice to you.
And yep:
you waive any right to a trial (by judge or jury), you waive any right to participate as a member of a class in a class action or similar proceeding
I’m sorry I’m not familiar with all the bullshit marketing names the companies use for their products. If you buy a game, and it goes into your Ubisoft account, and they delete your account - you still have the game, it’s just a useless brick because of the DRM, but all the bytes are still there. Regardless, the same provision is on the other ToS page as well:
These Terms may be terminated or suspended at any time, without notice, for any reason
If it wasn’t in the terms and they deleted your account, what would you do? And would that action be different than if account deletion was outlined in a terms agreement?
Pretty sure you don’t own ANY games anymore, unless you fully pirate them. The physical discs aren’t big enough to have the full game and really contain the license to play, which is why downloads and updates are prevalent before you get to play on most systems.
Is this correct or have I read incorrectly online?
If I’m correct, then my point is really that if players let this stand then a company can do anything to any game you’ve “bought”.
Depends. Some console games contain the entirety of the game. However oftentimes they still might require a system update to play, which won’t be available forever.
Pretty sure if they were doing that it would be a field day for lawsuits.
Oh I’m sure in the ToS it mentions that we don’t own anything and they have the right to cut access whenever they want for any reason and that you can’t sue them for it
I’m not a lawyer, but I vaguely remember hearing that Terms of Service can’t protect a company from everything. I seriously doubt a company could get away with that when it was brought to court.
yeah but proving that would cost more than any of us could ever afford
That’s what class actions are for
Don’t worry, they got it covered:
If I am reading this correctly which probably I am not, 10k is very little for a class action so most wouldn’t be covered at all by this restriction, it seems like a way to not have lawyers costs for very small class actions, but big ones would be “allowed” That again… I am probably misreading it, I am not a lawyer.
You are right, you are misreading it 😎. The $10,000 is for your personal claims, not the total class action value. Moreover, class action is prohibited twice here. The first clause:
Has not dollar limit. The language here is extremely confusing because of the double repetition. I can’t even tell if the arbitration is “binding” or not. I’ll assume that it is, based on the legal principle “exception that proves the rule” combined with clause 13.2 c). Here’s my not-a-lawyer flowchart interpretation consistent with every clause:
(Any actual lawyer feel free to correct me in case a small claims court trial doesn’t count as a trial by a judge)
Also, under clause 13.3 any legal action must be adjudicated in the courts of the State of California. I don’t know if that includes small claims courts, or if there is some legal tradition that small claims can always be filed in state of residence of the consumer. California has a $10k small claims limit, so if there is no such tradition, to me it appears there are NO situations where you can file any court case, big or small, consistent with these rules.
Of course, but OP brought up that they couldn’t be sued. I was just pointing out that if someone was willing to test it, I bet they could come out on top.
Yep
And yep:
Let’s clarify that althought they probably have a similar thing somewhere, that one it’s in reference to Ubisoft+, their subscription service.
I’m sorry I’m not familiar with all the bullshit marketing names the companies use for their products. If you buy a game, and it goes into your Ubisoft account, and they delete your account - you still have the game, it’s just a useless brick because of the DRM, but all the bytes are still there. Regardless, the same provision is on the other ToS page as well:
If it wasn’t in the terms and they deleted your account, what would you do? And would that action be different than if account deletion was outlined in a terms agreement?
I doubt it would tbh. It’s more or less equivalent to Nintendo shutting down the eshop, or an MMO terminating its online service.
You do not own digital games, you own a license to use a service that may or may not be provided to you.
Hmm.
Pretty sure you don’t own ANY games anymore, unless you fully pirate them. The physical discs aren’t big enough to have the full game and really contain the license to play, which is why downloads and updates are prevalent before you get to play on most systems.
Is this correct or have I read incorrectly online?
If I’m correct, then my point is really that if players let this stand then a company can do anything to any game you’ve “bought”.
Depends. Some console games contain the entirety of the game. However oftentimes they still might require a system update to play, which won’t be available forever.
So yeah, you don’t really own anything.
Or if you buy them on GOG