• just_another_person@lemmy.world
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      1 month ago

      She’s not a threat, she’s running a spoiler campaign to siphon votes. She’s deliberately exploiting a system to affect an outcome.

      That’s like me showing up outside your house and job and plastering “UniversalMonk wants to diddle your kids” posters everywhere. Whether it’s true or not is irrelevant if someone believes the bullshit and subscribes to the idea.

      Being a threat would actually take effort to run a real campaign with real ideas.

      • Socialist Mormon Satanist@lemmy.worldOP
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        1 month ago

        She’s deliberately exploiting a system to affect an outcome.

        Then that sounds like Democrats think she’s a threat. If she wasn’t a threat, all of that would be a non-issue. I mean, they have spent money on new ads against her. If they didn’t think she was a thread, they wouldn’t have done that.

        And to your point, if you did that to me with your signs, I would definitely view you as a threat. Regardless of your motivation or the falsehood.

              • Socialist Mormon Satanist@lemmy.worldOP
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                1 month ago

                But legit or not, if she wasn’t a threat, they’d ignore her. And they are not ignoring her, they just released new ads against her yesterday. So obviously they see her as threat.

                • AmbiguousProps@lemmy.today
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                  1 month ago

                  She’s a spoiler, not a threat. A threat requires her to hold actual power, which she is not capable of doing without the GOP in her back pocket. She won’t win, she can literally only take votes from the two primary candidates, like every other third party candidate (yes, including whichever flavor you claim to be supporting this afternoon). The Dems are worried about Kamala losing by 100 votes because idiots think that they’re getting a one up by voting third party, when actually all they’re doing is pissing away their vote and empowering a Trump victory.

                  Jill Stein is a GOP operative. That’s all she is. She doesn’t care about Gaza, the climate, or anything else, because if she did she would drop out to avoid a spoiler that would ruin all of those things due to a Trump win. She’s a tool for Trump.

                  ETA: Let me be clear, I don’t give a shit who you, Monk vote for, because you clearly are already a lost cause. My comments to you are always for everyone else who actually cares about not electing a fascist, and never you. Sorry if I confused you by thinking I care about your personal vote or thoughts.

              • Socialist Mormon Satanist@lemmy.worldOP
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                1 month ago

                Doesn’t matter. And I don’t care, because I’m not voting for Harris or Trump. If the Democrat Party is that scared of some “spoiler effect,” then they shouldn’t be such jerks to people who don’t believe in all the same things they do. Thank you! :)

                • LifeGivesYouLemmys
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                  1 month ago

                  Sorry facing facts is impossible for you Mr “I don’t block people I disagree with”

    • LifeGivesYouLemmys
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      1 month ago

      She’s fucking siphoning votes away from the candidate closest to her supposed views, in a close election where the concept of democracy is at stake. Beyond-obviously. You think you just can just handwave facts away but you never will succeed at that with your campaign of bullshit. You want to imply the threat is that she can win which is laughable. Pretty much all of us see who Shill Stein is.

      • queermunist she/her
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        1 month ago

        She’s fucking siphoning votes away from the candidate closest to her supposed views

        “Closest” is doing a lot of work there.

          • queermunist she/her
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            1 month ago

            She’s kind of ideologically incoherent and I’m certainly no supporter of hers, but she is far to the left of both of them.

            Hitler-lite is closer to her position than Hitler-delux, but “closer” is doing a lot of work there.

            • LifeGivesYouLemmys
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              1 month ago

              I don’t understand what point you’re making. My point was clear-- if you actually wanted a small fraction of Stein’s ideas to have a chance, you’d vote for Harris. Lemmy users can pretend all day that spoilers candidates aren’t real but that’s ridiculous, of course they are.

              • queermunist she/her
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                1 month ago

                Harris is running to the right of Biden in 2020. The point is to emphasize how far she actually is from Stein and that you’re using “closer” in a really loose way to hand-wave the gulf between them. Vote for Harris if you want, but I want you to know you are voting for Hitler-lite to stop Hitler-delux.

                • LifeGivesYouLemmys
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                  1 month ago

                  Irrelevant exaggeration for distracting from my valid point. I’m glad you feel more smug now though

                  • queermunist she/her
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                    1 month ago

                    She and Biden are doing genocide and she’s promising to continue in her administration.

                • LifeGivesYouLemmys
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                  1 month ago

                  I’ve never quite understood this obsession with telling everyone how right wing they are all the time as a singular focus. It’s incredibly unhelpful and annoying. Kamala Harris wants to do some left wing things. America is right wing generally, no one needs you to remind us condescendingly every 45 seconds

                  • queermunist she/her
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                    1 month ago

                    I don’t want anyone lying to themselves and thinking Harris isn’t that bad. You, yourself, are trying to soften her image by saying she wants “to do some leftwing things.” That is unhelpful. She wants to do a fascist crackdown on the border. She wants more trade war with China. She wants to give unlimited support to the fascist regime in Israel as it does genocide and pushes us towards WW3. She wants to expand fracking and fossil fuels. She wants to appoint Republicans into her cabinet. She’s dropped opposition to the death penalty. She wants “the most lethal military” in the world. She’s a cop.

                    She’s far to the right of where Biden was in 2020 and no where near Stein. She’s just closer to the center than Trump.

                    If someone says to me “I understand Harris is right-wing and, despite this, will support her to stop Trump” then that’s fine. What annoys me is when people try to apologize for her or ignore how right-wing she actually is compared to even Biden.

            • null@slrpnk.net
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              1 month ago

              I don’t actually understand her ideology, but the other candidates are literally Hitler

              The Lemmy Lefty archetype in full form.

              • queermunist she/her
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                1 month ago

                Her ideology is just a mishmash of moral positions, I understand that just fine. I just don’t respect it.

                The other candidates want to do genocide and start a world war, though, which makes them comparable to Hitler.

                  • queermunist she/her
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                    1 month ago

                    I consider her policies moralist, I don’t think she has a theoretical foundation.

                    Many of her policies would be at home in a leftwing government, like the jobs guarantee and debt cancellation and the rights to food/housing/healthcare, but that doesn’t make them Leftist. These are just moral positions. I think they’re good, sure, but I don’t think she has a real plan to make them happen.

                    Workers’ party or bust.

        • Todd Bonzalez@lemm.ee
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          1 month ago

          Fun fact: When Harris and Sanders were both Senators, she voted closer to him than any other senator. That includes support for universal healthcare and climate action (and pretty much everything else the Greens claim to stand for).

          • queermunist she/her
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            1 month ago

            Now that she’s the nominee she publicly distanced herself from Medicare for All and now supports fossil fuel extraction.

            She’s an opportunistic worm.

    • Agreed - Dems see her as a threat because she’s a spoiler candidate.

      From the other related article, https://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/4928622-democrats-swing-state-voters-jill-stein-trump-harris/

      The campaign argued that Harris could restore her base if she agreed to an arms embargo on Israel, but “apparently she prefers killing Palestinian children to winning the election.”

      I can’t and won’t given Stein full credit here - as she’s refused to state that she’d withdraw from the race and endorse Harris if Harris adopts this position (which would be tough for Dems to do even if Stein and the Green Party went this car). But she’s essentially and somewhat effectively remade her campaign into this single issue piece, and in a way that allows her to claim the moral high ground no matter how things shake out.

    • treefrog@lemm.ee
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      1 month ago

      More like pre-emptive blame shifting. Jill Stein voters aren’t going to win or lose this election.

      People who vote for her would just stay home and not vote if she wasn’t on the ballot.

      The issue is Palestine. It’s one of the things young voters mostly care about. And the administrations position on it isn’t going to draw out voters.

        • treefrog@lemm.ee
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          1 month ago

          Nader was more popular than Stein. Stein votes this cycle will be protest votes.

          If Stein wasn’t on the ticket or other third party candidates, the protest voters wouldn’t vote for Harris.

          They’d simply stay home.

          It’s Palestine that will lose the Dems this election if it’s lost. Or fuckery by Trump in Georgia.

          Either way the biggest danger to the Dems is poor voter turnout. And it’s funding a genocide that’s going to cause that, not the green party.

          • Eldritch@lemmy.world
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            1 month ago

            Who is more popular doesn’t matter. The whole point of Stein’s candidacy is not to be popular. Stine knows that she pulls votes away on the left. And she knows she cannot win. Which was never her goal. Her goal because she knows she pulls away votes on the left is to make it easier for Donald Trump to win. No more no less.

            Protest voting in national elections is not a thing. People keep talking about protest voting against Harris or Biden. If you’re going to make the claim. You also need to show evidence of how it will work. I have 250 plus years of evidence that protest voting in national elections doesn’t work. Do you have evidence of a single instance of it working?

            No the Democrats stance on Palestine will not lose them the election. If the Democrats lose the election someone with a worse stance on Palestine will win. So tell me how when they look at that they’re supposed to understand that their stance was bad therefore they lost when someone with a worse stance won. If you want someone to learn to be better. Someone better than them needs to win. If someone worse than them wins. That means they need to adjust their tac to better match the views of the ones who won.

            This bullshit myth of protest voting in a national election is exactly why things have gotten worse. Ignorant uninformed people flailing politically only succeeding and injuring themselves.

      • Socialist Mormon Satanist@lemmy.worldOP
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        1 month ago

        More like pre-emptive blame shifting. Jill Stein voters aren’t going to win or lose this election.

        Actually, that’s a great fucking point. And very accurate. Thank you!