2011 in Libya b2 was also used. Libya had hundreds of sam launchers, so I assume that was contested, though I can’t find as good of a breakdown as the other two.
Kosovo also had about a hundred sam missiles. Again I couldn’t find as good of a breakdown on where exactly the b2s flew relative to them.
So those are some times b2 has come into contact with air defense. Do you have any sources that they haven’t come into contact with air defense assets?
Hypersonics (at least the maneuverable boost glide versions China has) need to get into the upper atmosphere before coming back down gaining momentum. That means they effectively have a minimum range to get up to speed. That minimum range is already larger than any heavily contested air defense zone, making stealth on the carrier aircraft redundant.
Again, Iraq and Libya were not a technologically advanced nation by any stretch of imagination. The air defences you’ve listed are ancient, and have little to do with what modern systems are capable of.
The stealth tech reduces the signature, but it doesn’t make it go away entirely, and it’s vulnerable to different types of radars working in combination. Furthermore, nowadays there is a lot of other telemetry that can be integrated such as heat, and sound waves it produces, and all this data can be analyzed by a computer in real time to pinpoint it.
Hypersonics (at least the maneuverable boost glide versions China has) need to get into the upper atmosphere before coming back down gaining momentum. That means they effectively have a minimum range to get up to speed. That minimum range is already larger than any heavily contested air defense zone, making stealth on the carrier aircraft redundant.
China has a range of hypersonics the same way Russia does because they do tech transfer with each other. Russia has been launching hypersonics from ground, air, and sea, and these have been an absolute nightmare for NATO defences in Ukraine.
One other huge advantage of hypersonics is that they give very little reaction time to the enemy. Launching a bomber and waiting for it to get to the target literally takes hours. A hypersonic missile can hit within 5 minutes. This means that an integrated system can use a satellite to detect a target, such as a B2 landing on the airfield, and notify appropriate launch system to eliminate it, and a hypersonic missile will come down on it within 5 minutes from over a thousand km range.
The US has not had a peer conflict since the b2 entered service. (Good thing too!) But even so, Iraq had the heaviest air defenses at the time.
Obviously stealth just decreases the detection range, but it can decrease it so far that you can weave between the mile or so of air defense detection and still drop bombs.
Yeah hypersonics do do that, but none of that needs stealth! They’re standoff range munitions, you’re outside of the enemy air defense bubble when you fire them, because noone has an air defense bubble larger than their range.
Again, Iraq air defences were incredibly dated technology. They’re not representative of modern capabilities.
Obviously stealth just decreases the detection range, but it can decrease it so far that you can weave between the mile or so of air defense detection and still drop bombs.
Given that, as you admit, this hasn’t actually been tested in practice, nobody knows how well this works. The links I provided above make it pretty clear that stealth aircraft can in fact be detected, and this is just public unclassified stuff. Furthermore, as I’ve already stated earlier, the missiles and bombs the aircraft uses can themselves be intercepted.
Yeah hypersonics do do that, but none of that needs stealth! They’re standoff range munitions, you’re outside of the enemy air defense bubble when you fire them, because noone has an air defense bubble larger than their range.
Right, that’s my whole point. You don’t actually need stealth when you have weapons that can engage from outside enemy’s air defense bubble. And having weapons that can fly really fast makes them far more effective because they can engage very quickly despite long ranges. Response time is everything. Incidentally, the plasma bubble that’s created by a hypersonic weapon as it superheats air in flight also acts as radiowave absorbing sheath making the weapon stealth. This further reduces already minuscule response window.
Exactly. You can fix that by increasing the range of the weapons, or by decreasing the range of the air defense bubble with stealth.
Again, nowhere have I argued that stealth tech is useless. What I keep telling you is that these are two different types of weapons that serve different roles, and can complement each other. I really can’t understand why this is so hard for you to process.
I’ve explained to you repeatedly with multiple examples of the roles that hypersonic missiles are better at. You just kept ignoring that and repeating the same line over and over like a broken record. Read what I wrote and address that.
It’s f117, but with good planning they penetrated into bagdad, the most heavily defended city at that point, undetected.
https://youtu.be/zxRgfBXn6Mg
Though it wasn’t quite as heavily defended in 2003, b2s and f117s did quite well against bagdad in enduring freedom.
https://youtu.be/Atm8D5uqr-k
2011 in Libya b2 was also used. Libya had hundreds of sam launchers, so I assume that was contested, though I can’t find as good of a breakdown as the other two.
Kosovo also had about a hundred sam missiles. Again I couldn’t find as good of a breakdown on where exactly the b2s flew relative to them.
So those are some times b2 has come into contact with air defense. Do you have any sources that they haven’t come into contact with air defense assets?
Hypersonics (at least the maneuverable boost glide versions China has) need to get into the upper atmosphere before coming back down gaining momentum. That means they effectively have a minimum range to get up to speed. That minimum range is already larger than any heavily contested air defense zone, making stealth on the carrier aircraft redundant.
Again, Iraq and Libya were not a technologically advanced nation by any stretch of imagination. The air defences you’ve listed are ancient, and have little to do with what modern systems are capable of.
The stealth tech reduces the signature, but it doesn’t make it go away entirely, and it’s vulnerable to different types of radars working in combination. Furthermore, nowadays there is a lot of other telemetry that can be integrated such as heat, and sound waves it produces, and all this data can be analyzed by a computer in real time to pinpoint it.
https://www.researchgate.net/publication/224179944_Countering_Stealth_with_Passive_Multi-static_Low_Frequency_Radars
https://www.defensenews.com/global/europe/2023/08/10/hensoldt-unveils-a-deployable-package-of-its-twinvis-passive-radar/
https://bulgarianmilitary.com/2019/10/02/a-german-company-detected-the-invisible-f-35-with-its-own-radar-technology/
China has a range of hypersonics the same way Russia does because they do tech transfer with each other. Russia has been launching hypersonics from ground, air, and sea, and these have been an absolute nightmare for NATO defences in Ukraine.
One other huge advantage of hypersonics is that they give very little reaction time to the enemy. Launching a bomber and waiting for it to get to the target literally takes hours. A hypersonic missile can hit within 5 minutes. This means that an integrated system can use a satellite to detect a target, such as a B2 landing on the airfield, and notify appropriate launch system to eliminate it, and a hypersonic missile will come down on it within 5 minutes from over a thousand km range.
The US has not had a peer conflict since the b2 entered service. (Good thing too!) But even so, Iraq had the heaviest air defenses at the time.
Obviously stealth just decreases the detection range, but it can decrease it so far that you can weave between the mile or so of air defense detection and still drop bombs.
Yeah hypersonics do do that, but none of that needs stealth! They’re standoff range munitions, you’re outside of the enemy air defense bubble when you fire them, because noone has an air defense bubble larger than their range.
Again, Iraq air defences were incredibly dated technology. They’re not representative of modern capabilities.
Given that, as you admit, this hasn’t actually been tested in practice, nobody knows how well this works. The links I provided above make it pretty clear that stealth aircraft can in fact be detected, and this is just public unclassified stuff. Furthermore, as I’ve already stated earlier, the missiles and bombs the aircraft uses can themselves be intercepted.
Right, that’s my whole point. You don’t actually need stealth when you have weapons that can engage from outside enemy’s air defense bubble. And having weapons that can fly really fast makes them far more effective because they can engage very quickly despite long ranges. Response time is everything. Incidentally, the plasma bubble that’s created by a hypersonic weapon as it superheats air in flight also acts as radiowave absorbing sheath making the weapon stealth. This further reduces already minuscule response window.
So why is China building a stealth bomber?
Exactly. You can fix that by increasing the range of the weapons, or by decreasing the range of the air defense bubble with stealth.
Why do carpenters use hammers and screwdrivers?
Again, nowhere have I argued that stealth tech is useless. What I keep telling you is that these are two different types of weapons that serve different roles, and can complement each other. I really can’t understand why this is so hard for you to process.
Because they’re the best tools for the job
So what is the stealth bomber’s role that it is the best at?
I’ve explained to you repeatedly with multiple examples of the roles that hypersonic missiles are better at. You just kept ignoring that and repeating the same line over and over like a broken record. Read what I wrote and address that.
No, what are stealth bombers good at?
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