- cross-posted to:
- anime@hexbear.net
- cross-posted to:
- anime@hexbear.net
The manga: a college guy meets his childhood friend, who was formerly a boy but is now a woman, and has run away from home after an unspecified disagreement with her family which has left her with a significant amount of trauma; it’s implied she was bullied heavily in the time since they’ve last seen each other.
But don’t worry, she’s not trans! She just got an illness which turned her into a woman!
The manga: a high school boy with an interest in make-up uses his gloomy, depressed (male) childhood friend as a model to improve his skills. This causes said friend to have an “awakening” and start dressing as a woman, and to overall be a much happier, brighter, outgoing person.
But don’t worry, the friend is not trans! He’s just a boy who crossdresses because his childhood friend likes him better that way!
The manga: a high school boy joins a club where the members can turn into magical girls, which in his case involves physically transforming into a girl. When in girlmode, he’s much happier and enjoys his life much more, and overall prefers staying in girl mode; when the ability to transform is temporarily taken away from him, he sinks into a deep depressive episode.
But don’t worry, he’s not trans! He’s just a boy who enjoys being a girl!
The manga: a college student loses a bet and has to crossdress for a night out on the town, and meets and hooks up with a butch girl; they fall in love and start dating. The boy always crossdressed when they meet, and starts enjoying being “treated like a girl” in the relationship and starts crossdressing even when he doesn’t have to meet his girlfriend and enjoys activities such as clothes shopping and make-up and putting on nail polish.
But don’t worry, he’s not trans! He’s just a boy who crossdresses to please his butch girlfriend!
The manga: a guy is magically turned into a girl as a result of saving his best friend, the crown prince, from an assassination attempt. The prince decides that he has to take responsibility, and asks the new girl to marry him; despite being smitten she refuses, wanting to date first. She is later offered a way to go back to being a man, but when she does turn back she’s disgusted by her own appearance and depressed all the time, ultimately deciding to stay a girl.
But don’t worry, she’s not trans! She’s just a boy who’s been magically turned into a woman! And decides not to turn back when she can! Because she’s not trans! Somehow!
“But we can’t write trans women in manga! It’s just not something that you do!”
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these are all real btw
1st: Kare to Kanojo no Sentaku (The Choice Is His & Hers)
2nd: Koisuru (Otome) no Tsukurikata (I Think I Turned My Childhood Friend Into a Girl)
3nd: Magical Trans! and Mahou Shoujo Bu e Youkoso! by the same author
4th: Ikemen Joshi to Josou Danshi (Handsome Girl and Crossdressing Boy)
5th: Shinyuu Ouji to Koshiginchaku (The Prince’s Close Friend and Follower)
the following is not from the og post and is where my own opinions come inthe really grating thing about this isn’t any one specific example. if one of these existed as-is and the rest were willing to actually acknowledge transness and genderqueerness as it exists in the real world i wouldn’t mind so much, or if the characters discussed the possibility of transitioning and decided it wasn’t for them. and it’s not even just these 5, there are dozens of other examples. these are just off the top of my head! these are mostly characters that pass (though some had some magic involved) and the narrative never accepts the possibility they might be trans, or even that they could choose to be a gender other than the one they were assigned at birth. 1 is transmasc, but most are transfem
chihiro danganronpa
any of the fgo ones, astolfo, chevalier d’eon etc.
naoto persona
ferris re:zero
dragona jjba (who even takes “injections to give the appearance of breasts”!!! that’s hormones!!! she’s taking hormones!!!)
as well as several other ranma characters, like ukyo or konatsu
rosado fire emblem
mizuki project sekai
hato genshiken
loran turn a gundam (only kind of, and i’m willing to give this one a pass given it’s not really about the gender stuff and also takes place ~1914)
hibari stop hibari-kunand none of these are from the otokonoko genre because i don’t read it because it pisses me off, but there’s a whole genre of stuff closer to what the og post is about where the gender is the entire focus of the story (which is only the case for hibari of the ones i mentioned). this is a massive trend and it far outnumbers the amount of actual trans characters in these spaces
Many authors are repressing.
If I say that in the wrong crowd though and I’d get jumped on for telling people that claim they’re cis that they’re not actually cis they just haven’t realised it yet as if I’m invalidating cis identities or some shit.
I’m sorry but there is a massive difference between telling a person who might be closeted that they are obviously closeted vs telling a trans person the identity is invalid. The cis people who claim this is the same thing are just transphobes that recognise bringing people out of the closet increases the number of open trans people.
A lot of actually-trans people have been convinced by this contingent of whiny cis people that telling any of the obvious cases of closeted people that they are closeted is a bad thing though. I have come to disagree with this over time and think the trend will eventually be for closet cases to be treated almost the same as they are with sexuality.
yeah. there’s a heartbreaking interview with the author of stop hibari-kun where they basically say “i’ve always been very dysphoric and hate being a man and wish i was a woman and i channel that into my manga about a trans teenager being free to do what she wants,” and at least one of the above mangaka said on twitter they wished they were a woman and would immediately push a button that turned them into one
It’s really really annoying to me that attractiveness and gender is a barrier to these people breaking out and finding happiness in themselves. Like, we all know they would be massively happier once they get to be the real versions of themselves. We get that.
Being an unattractive man gets tied up in their brains as a more preferable thing to the possibility of being an unattractive woman.
It’s actually a really big signal of the internalised mysogyny these people are carrying from society because it tells us how this person thinks about every unattractive woman in the street.
And they would still be significantly happier than they are now, even if they only ever achieved being an unattractive woman.
definitely. it’s also wrapped up in all kinds of dysphoria and cultural depictions of transfemininity as being horrifying and not wanting to be like that. when you think your options are repressing or being buffalo bill…
The worst bit is that way more often than not, with a some work on their health and appearance, hormones would make them perfectly attractive in a traditional sense, as a woman. It’s all just cultural misogyny that unless a woman is a 10/10 smoke show she is a “failed” woman.
If we had a working class media we would normalise the full breadth of women in media. Arguably men would improve slightly because I get the impression that men who do not take care of themselves are over-represented in media.
Part of the problem is that the beauty standard is different for men and women. And these closeted trans women are making the decision that they can meet the beauty standard for men more easily than they can meet the beauty standard for women, and it is this specific difference that represents the barrier for their coming out. It is a “life will be harder for me” calculus built on a social normalisation of men not taking care of themselves being acceptable. I’m thinking out loud a little here but I think that the decision is “I don’t take care of myself” (a behaviour driven by their dysphoria) which then manifests into “I still wouldn’t take care of myself when I transition” which then manifests to “I shouldn’t transition because I would suck as a woman”. Part of the miscalculation here is that they don’t realise that being happier in their bodies would also drive them to greater care of themselves.
I’m thinking out loud a little here but I think that the decision is “I don’t take care of myself” (a behaviour driven by their dysphoria) which then manifests into “I still wouldn’t take care of myself when I transition” which then manifests to “I shouldn’t transition because I would suck as a woman”. Part of the miscalculation here is that they don’t realise that being happier in their bodies would also drive them to greater care of themselves.
no need to call me out like this 😔
I’d get jumped on for telling people that claim they’re cis that they’re not actually cis
And yet you have cis people rolling around doing the “wuuuh no way maybe ur not trans” bullshit 24/7.
Ikemen Joshi to Josou Danshi
I mean, it’s probably flaming hot garbage, like y’know… unless??? There is a theme I am seeing of trans women being paired with cool butch ladies and I am for it, I want to add to this collection, so…
Perhaps for a bit of some kind? I could just try it to be funny???
Edit: Eh it’s bad
Edit 2: I have read 40 chapters, pls send help. Occasionally it bumps up against being good, but shitass gender bender manga cannot HELP THEMSELVES from randomly spewing the most gender essentialist dogshit
i’ve heard that it’s not terrible, just expect to be frustrated by the gender takes. the translations for a bunch of these are done by trans women, and you can see them talking in the notes about how they still enjoy these even though they cited them as justifications for why they weren’t trans despite wanting to be women before
I wonder if Hachirumi Translations isn’t the best one to read then, or if I’m just hypersensitive to this shit. I am frustrated by the gender takes®
yeah it sucks. in this comment thread i talk about a bunch of stuff that’s like. actually trans and that i enjoy. it’s mostly web novels though, but there’s some manga and visual novels as well. this post has a trans^2lator* talking about a bunch of different manga they mostly enjoy and how well they handle gender. i can’t cosign the ones i haven’t read (and i personally really didn’t enjoy majo no geboku to maou no tsuno) but there are some pretty good ones
*trans translator who focuses on gender manga including one of the manga listed here
I had seen your post :) I was just kind of like “Huh, I kinda miss manga, maybe it won’t be horrible again?” (Narrator: “It was horrible again.”) I abandoned reading manga for queer reasons yeeeears ago when looking for wlw stories, so I’m not even remotely surprised that ✨ gender stuff ✨ is kinda scuffed in manga. Like, I see “, very heavily implied trans” and think “My coffee maker has one job - to make coffee! I am not subject to coffe undertones!”
yeahthere’s some stuff in wlw manga that’s really good but also a whole lot of dreck. it’s much better than trans (and especially transfem) manga but that’s such a low bar. in general manga is not a consistent place to go for queer stories, even if it’s infinitely better than anime. if you really want to dig you can find some gems (read otherside picnic) but it often doesn’t feel worth it after reading 15 chapters of the blandest yuri imaginable or yet another “trans undertones” manga that people assured me was ‘definitely for real gonna end up canon trans this time, it’s not bait i swear’
People keep telling me abt Otherside Picnic, maybe someday I will read it. But for real:
doesn’t feel worth it after reading 15 chapters of the blandest yuri imaginable or yet another “trans undertones” manga that people assured me was ‘definitely for real gonna end up canon trans this time, it’s not bait i swear’
I could have written this. This is why I started reading weird indiepub novels and ao3 stuff lol
yeah indie published and online stuff is good! we’ve talked about it before but it’s such a breath of fresh air reading stuff written by actual queer people whose lived experiences have any overlap with my own. i’m planning on reading the last girlscout because it seems super neat (and her other book is a no go because spiders creep me out), and when i’m in the right mood i’ll for sure check out nevada
otherside picnic is really good, and the main characters pov is so good i can’t imagine the manga or anime do it justice. she’s such a weirdo
That picture is very relatable
have you seen the original comic?
this is wonderful
ngl, kinda wanna read a couple of these even if they seem a little troublesome.
nah, that’s fair enough. i read so much of this stuff in middle school and high school when i was deeply repressed. but i will say i feel way better having mostly switched over to actually trans stories, whether it’s manga like love me for who i am or independent stuff on scribblehub like once in a lifetime that do similar stories but are written by trans people and have actual trans characters
There are actually trans stories? That is actually surprising and is preferable since the ones that generally wave off the transness are…not great for the psyche sometimes. I don’t like testing on whether I’m having a good day or a bad day by reading something that can make it a really bad day. I’ll be damned if the ones in your main post weren’t interesting sounding though.
there are a lot of actually trans stories! the one i linked is about a teenager starting a band and trying to prevent their voice from dropping because they just like how it sounds when their singing, and so start taking gray market hrt and crossdressing and pretending to be a girl as a prank and getting really sad whenever they get called male and i wonder what’s going on there? it’s not done yet (and the mc hasn’t yet come out) but i’m having a nice time
alex is about a waiter at a restaurant who has to wear the womans uniform for kind of contrived reasons but then comes to some realizations about herself and has to make some changes in her life to reflect that
kisses, curses, and love is about a family who was cursed so that all their male members would turn into girls when they were first kissed by one. the main characters are blake and angel, trying to get blake her first kiss so she can magically become a girl while angel tries to not be too jealous of her easy hrt
performative masculinity is about a closeted (but transitioning) high school student who makes a new friend and decides she can afford to be more true to herself
show girl is about someone who is forced to dress as a woman because her boss didn’t hire enough girls to man the booth at a trade show, only to realize she might be having a really nice time as a woman and that might mean some things
the harem protagonist was turned into a girl!! and doesn’t want to change back!!!?? is about the protagonist of a 90s style harem comedy being turned into a girl and deciding she prefers it that way and is definitely trans, and then continues to have wacky harem hijinks
to own the libs is about a conservative convinced that some people must be transitioning in bad faith to take advantage of (???) only to realize (after starting hrt, getting a legal name change and otherwise fully transitioning) that that isn’t true and she’s much happier than she ever was before
i’m pretty sure these were all written by trans authors and everything. and these are only the ones focused on it! there are a lot of good things written by trans people with more minor trans characters, or with major trans characters where gender isn’t the focus (like unjust depths, about submarine mecha communists). the linked stories are all pretty similar in vibes and can get a little saccharine, but they’re all reasonably close to the manga example premises
sorry if you meant trans focused manga, i have less recs there, (and a lot of what i have is iffy), but i remember wandering son being good, i’m in love with the villainess has a pretty good trans character apparently (though i haven’t read it), to strip the flesh was a good one about a trans man, and the mimosa connection is supposed to be good but isn’t translated yet (but will be soon)
Hey, either or works for me. Recently having finished Our LIfe (visual novel), I’ve been trying to absorb as much trans/trans friendly literature as possible. Anything that makes me feel emotions. Good, bad, whatever. I’m just glad to feel them now.
Anyways, this is a fantastic list. Thank you very much for taking your time for this
if you like visual novels, check out we know the devil, heaven will be mine, or umineko: when they cry! all have trans characters and we know the devil and heaven will be mine are i’m pretty sure entirely written by trans people
we know the devil is about a group of queer teens stuck in a christian summer camp and trying to keep the devil at bay. heaven will be mine is about a bunch of lesbians with giant robots fighting and flirting for ideological control of space. and umineko is a murder mystery where a rich family dies and a witch is blamed that’s much longer than the bible
Thanks once again for the recommendations. And thank you Steam sale for being able to put these into my library. I’m going to have to thank you someday for all of this. Seriously.
of course! i’m just really happy to help
one more story for the road, a little vice is about the best friend of a magical girl dealing with how jealous she is of everything about her friend’s life while being a very dense egg (that everyone but her sees through). it’s very good so far. very much in the sailor moon or precure mold of magical girls, so not too dark outside the protagonist’s headspace which is pretty bleak at times. but it’s almost certainly going to end with everyone happy
I thought the first one was Alice is back and was disappointed since I was interested in reading it. Glad I was wrong lol.
okaeri alice is kind of similar i think? but idk i haven’t read it. i know one of my friends says the mangaka is definitely just trans and deeply repressed and closeted about it
Hmmm
hmmm?
hmmmmmmm
hm
