When I read the title of the video, I was like what? What year is this? That ship has sailed a long time ago, friend…
But Frost’s definition of indie is very much his own. It is not non-commercial, but it hinges on not caving to commercial pressures.
Funnily enough, three months after that video, corporate greed led Frost and others to abandon The Escapist and regroup under Second Wind.
(Hi! I’m new here. Expect me to go through and answer some old posts Soon™. I hope I can get used to Lemmy. Never got used to Reddit…)
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Can you explain the whole drama? I’m not able to understand what’s happening? Who is the one narrating the video? Why do I see so much anger in the comment section?
If by drama you mean the issue with The Escapist and their (former) team, I only know things superficially, but it seems that the company that owns The Escapist has decided to cut costs and is firing a lot of people. Frost (the one narrating the video) and Yahtzee, the “face” of The Escapist videos, along with other less visible folks, probably, have quit in solidarity. They are forming their own new channel.
But I didn’t see anything in the comment section pertaining that matter.
Nice that there is some activity here, welcome guys! I’m also not apt in video game journalism, but from what I gather the people who made this video were fired from an important mag shortly after releasing this video, and from a short reading this might be connected to them being not compatible enough with the (assumed) needs of the market.
So I’ve been mulling about one thing mentioned here, this “demand for uniqueness”. So what if you like something so much that you make it your own, give it your own twists? Wouldn’t forcing yourself to be “original” the same as bending to the will of the market? It’s just a different perception of the market, or of a different market. Variations and mods should be okay. Sometimes their value might not be obvious to someone outside whatever niche-within-a-niche you’re in, and that should be okay!
Now for yet another different, but related angle, I quote mino_dev from the video’s comment section:
As an indie developer myself… I dunno. When I started out I think I believed what this video is saying, because on some level it’s what all your friends and the Youtube essayists say. Indies must be unique, and make what truly speaks to them, market be damned.
I made something that I thought was really unique for my first game, and it did okay. But, just okay. It does have its players who have played it to death, clocking in 4 digit hour counts, but in general I don’t think there’s a lot of people that have even heard of it. When you make something like that people at conventions will often remark, “I bet there would be some people who would be REALLY into this… but it’s not my thing”. And you’ll hear it a whole lot.
The next game I’m making is a roguelike, and there seems to be a lot more excitement about it. When I take it to conventions, I don’t hear “I bet other people would really like this”, instead I get “so when’s this coming out? How much? Will there be more classes? Will there be modding?”, the kind of questions asked by people who have already decided to buy the game. And maybe they’ll tell their friends about it too.
Sometimes you forget that “the market” is people. Then you meet people and are reminded of that.
While we may admire the lyrical artist who just pours the contents of their heart, not minding whether anyone will appreciate it… community has value too. I just wanted to mention it en passant, cause it’s a conversation that could branch out a lot…
Variations and mods should be okay. Sometimes their value might not be obvious to someone outside whatever niche-within-a-niche you’re in, and that should be okay!
I absolutely agree. To illustrate this: https://drmortalwombat.itch.io/missile-defence this is a wonderful C64-fan remake very close to its model. It is a well done, nice underground game that does exactly what the dev wanted to do. Yet it only works well if the “clone”-version has some quality. Creativity in gameplay might make a game worthwhile even if there are stronger technical problems, but if your “Tetris” clone sucks you are out of luck, nobody will want to play it nowhere.
While we may admire the lyrical artist who just pours the contents of their heart, not minding whether anyone will appreciate it… community has value too. I just wanted to mention it en passant, cause it’s a conversation that could branch out a lot…
I want to play the games made by lyrical artists, and I try to make games for people who search art in gaming. And I believe I neither can ( because this production require a professionell production and behavior) nor want (because these games do not interest me) to meet the requirements of the players who form the large of the “current market” as things are atm. If you want to make a living from game dev, this will of course not work out for you.
