When FDR created the minimum wage he explicitly stated that someone making it should be able to live in some comfort. That meant not just food and shelter, but some savings and a chance to have a few nice things.
In 1960, minimum wage was $1.00/hour. The average house was $11,000.00. Two people could eat and go to a concert for $5.00. In those days, $1 million was an incredible fortune.
That’s the other crazy thing. Look at all the millionaire actors and music stars. They have much bigger incomes than past artists, but is Tom Hanks or Taylor Swift really that much richer than John Wayne or Marilyn Monroe? A doctor today is giving his family the life a moderately successful plumber had 50 years ago.
These historical comparisons always get me. Yeah, as a middle class American in 2024 I have a microwave and health insurance which does mean in some ways my life is “better” than Andrew Carnegie’s life 130 years ago. But he could just hire a huge staff for his mansion. He could buy whole libraries and gift them to cities.
Your comparisons of a modern doctor to Marilyn Monroe… Well a modern doctor is probably working 60 hours a week to get that $300,000 salary. Marilyn Monroe probably could have just… Retired while the doctor needs to work another couple decades to pay off student loans…
There’s no apple to apple comparison. Standard of living and expectations change. But you can’t just erase the simple pleasures of being famously rich because now microwaves exist.
Yeah and they are still bad comparisons. A doctor will command respect and prestige in their community in a way unfortunately a plumber will generally not. Inflation and technological advancements don’t really change that.
Your argument seems cousin to the Fox News type about microwaves and refrigerators. I don’t really think it makes sense to make these time traveling comparisons at all.
The wages of fast food workers have been increasing over the past decade. Ten years ago, their median wage was $8.69/hr. Today, it’s over $14/hr. In California, the minimum is now $20/hr.
Increased wages for low income workers are good, since they have outpaced inflation. But they will inevitably result in increased prices. It’s unrealistic to expect the employer to absorb all of the increased costs.
And fast food employers often couldn’t absorb the wage increases even if they wanted to. Remember, a McDonald’s employee isn’t paid by McDonald’s HQ, they are paid by the person who runs the individual location, who is also paying McDonald’s HQ for ingredients. Some of the franchise owners are doing well, some of them aren’t, but all of them are going to raise prices.
In other words, if you don’t want to pay more for fast food, then you don’t actually want to see fast food workers earn a better wage.
In other words, if you don’t want to pay more for fast food, then you don’t actually want to see fast food workers earn a better wage.
If a business relies on exploitation, it shouldn’t exist. If paying the workers a living wage means raising the prices beyond a sustainable level for the business, this business shouldn’t exist. If a business pays out millions in bonuses to it’s executives while the workers are relying on government subsidies, the business shouldn’t exist.
I’m happy to say that I emphatically want better wages for service industry workers. IDC how much food goes up, or how many mega franchises have to close for it. Either better wages, or cause these these super franchises to close so mom and pops and open instead.
I also don’t think it’s unrealistic to expect businesses to give up a small portion of their infinite growth targets to actually cover their employees needs. Maybe a large departure from the past 50 years, but it’s absolutely something most of them can afford.
If a business genuinely can’t afford it, then I’d also be okay with my tax money going towards a business analysis for that owner to find a way to make it work. If they still can’t, then how long were they really going to be open anyway and what were they really adding to their community?
unrealistic to expect businesses to give up a small portion of their infinite growth targets
Almost no restaurants, including fast food restaurants, have infinite growth targets. A lot of them are struggling to survive.
From a business perspective, most fast food franchises are mom-and-pop locations. They are not owned by a giant corporation. The giant corporation simply sells them ingredients and sets their menu.
Median fast food wage in US is now $14/hr. A Big Mac in Denmark is now 49 krone, which is $7.10
Of course, it’s still true that unions provide better pay and benefits to employees. But the price of a Big Mac is roughly a third of the hourly wage in both the US and Denmark.
When FDR created the minimum wage he explicitly stated that someone making it should be able to live in some comfort. That meant not just food and shelter, but some savings and a chance to have a few nice things.
In 1960, minimum wage was $1.00/hour. The average house was $11,000.00. Two people could eat and go to a concert for $5.00. In those days, $1 million was an incredible fortune.
And now, $1 million probably isnt even enough to retire
That’s the other crazy thing. Look at all the millionaire actors and music stars. They have much bigger incomes than past artists, but is Tom Hanks or Taylor Swift really that much richer than John Wayne or Marilyn Monroe? A doctor today is giving his family the life a moderately successful plumber had 50 years ago.
What is a doctor if not a body plumber?
Now you’re plumbing the depths in search of cuteness.
These historical comparisons always get me. Yeah, as a middle class American in 2024 I have a microwave and health insurance which does mean in some ways my life is “better” than Andrew Carnegie’s life 130 years ago. But he could just hire a huge staff for his mansion. He could buy whole libraries and gift them to cities.
Your comparisons of a modern doctor to Marilyn Monroe… Well a modern doctor is probably working 60 hours a week to get that $300,000 salary. Marilyn Monroe probably could have just… Retired while the doctor needs to work another couple decades to pay off student loans…
There’s no apple to apple comparison. Standard of living and expectations change. But you can’t just erase the simple pleasures of being famously rich because now microwaves exist.
I compared Monroe to Taylor Swift.
I compared the doctor to a plumber.
Yeah and they are still bad comparisons. A doctor will command respect and prestige in their community in a way unfortunately a plumber will generally not. Inflation and technological advancements don’t really change that.
Your argument seems cousin to the Fox News type about microwaves and refrigerators. I don’t really think it makes sense to make these time traveling comparisons at all.
Where did I talk about the plumber being as respected as the doctor?
According to a financial advisor I recently spoke with, it’s not. Guess I’ll be working all the way into my grave. 🤷♂️
The wages of fast food workers have been increasing over the past decade. Ten years ago, their median wage was $8.69/hr. Today, it’s over $14/hr. In California, the minimum is now $20/hr.
Increased wages for low income workers are good, since they have outpaced inflation. But they will inevitably result in increased prices. It’s unrealistic to expect the employer to absorb all of the increased costs.
And fast food employers often couldn’t absorb the wage increases even if they wanted to. Remember, a McDonald’s employee isn’t paid by McDonald’s HQ, they are paid by the person who runs the individual location, who is also paying McDonald’s HQ for ingredients. Some of the franchise owners are doing well, some of them aren’t, but all of them are going to raise prices.
In other words, if you don’t want to pay more for fast food, then you don’t actually want to see fast food workers earn a better wage.
If a business relies on exploitation, it shouldn’t exist. If paying the workers a living wage means raising the prices beyond a sustainable level for the business, this business shouldn’t exist. If a business pays out millions in bonuses to it’s executives while the workers are relying on government subsidies, the business shouldn’t exist.
That’s true. But restaurant owners aren’t paying millions to anyone.
And hiking prices to pay fast food employees more isn’t unsustainable. It just means customers won’t eat fast food as often as they used to.
I’m happy to say that I emphatically want better wages for service industry workers. IDC how much food goes up, or how many mega franchises have to close for it. Either better wages, or cause these these super franchises to close so mom and pops and open instead.
I also don’t think it’s unrealistic to expect businesses to give up a small portion of their infinite growth targets to actually cover their employees needs. Maybe a large departure from the past 50 years, but it’s absolutely something most of them can afford.
If a business genuinely can’t afford it, then I’d also be okay with my tax money going towards a business analysis for that owner to find a way to make it work. If they still can’t, then how long were they really going to be open anyway and what were they really adding to their community?
Almost no restaurants, including fast food restaurants, have infinite growth targets. A lot of them are struggling to survive.
From a business perspective, most fast food franchises are mom-and-pop locations. They are not owned by a giant corporation. The giant corporation simply sells them ingredients and sets their menu.
https://dn.truthorfiction.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/11/23134833/0955DC71-829C-4CED-8AFB-68B5C913B2F3.jpeg
That’s out of date.
Median fast food wage in US is now $14/hr. A Big Mac in Denmark is now 49 krone, which is $7.10
Of course, it’s still true that unions provide better pay and benefits to employees. But the price of a Big Mac is roughly a third of the hourly wage in both the US and Denmark.