Possibly the worst defense yet of Garry Tan’s tweeting of death threats towards San Francisco’s elected legislature. In yet more evidence for my “HN is a Nazi bar” thesis, this take is from an otherwise-respected cryptographer and security researcher. Choice quote:

sorry, but 2Pac is now dad music, I don’t make the rules

Best sneer so far is this comment, which links to this Key & Peele sketch about violent rap lyrics in the context of gang violence.

  • swlabr@awful.systemsEnglish
    12·
    10 months ago

    corbin’s already nailed it. This is just another example of Nazi apologia, in which someone makes death threats that their supporters try to defend in public as just metaphors. I don’t think it’s essential to refute what the OP was saying, but here’s my attempt:

    But this is a deeply stupid story with a lede that basically says “I’m unfamiliar with even the most most famous 90s hip-hop”. Tan, like many, many, many Internet commenters before him, was quoting Tupac’s Hit 'Em Up, which, unless you think Tupac was literally calling out hits on Chino XL, was not intended to be a true threat at the time, and certainly couldn’t reasonably be taken as one today.

    Yeah, that’s not how any of this works. As stated in the article,

    The “die slow, motherfucker” line was a reference to a Tupac Shakur song, and Tan later apologized. That 1996 song, “Hit ‘Em Up,” escalated the simmering East Coast-West Coast rap rivalry into a lethal feud; Shakur was gunned down three months after its release.

    So the OP is straight up wrong about being “unfamiliar with […] 90s hip-hop,” the research is right there. Also, I am not well versed in rap and rap culture, but I understand that in the 90s, rap and hip hop were intertwined with gangs and murder- thinking that a death threat in a song was not literal and “not intended to be a true threat at the time” is… naive at best, I imagine.

    OP also says the threats “certainly couldn’t reasonably be taken as one today.” I don’t think this is true. Let’s look at the threats themselves:

    […] Fuck Mobb Deep! Fuck Biggie! / Fuck Bad Boy as a staff, record label, and as a motherfuckin’ crew! / And if you wanna be down with Bad Boy, then fuck you too! / Chino XL, fuck you too! / All you motherfuckers, fuck you too! / (Take money, take money) / All of y’all motherfuckers, fuck you, die slow! / Motherfucker, my .44 make sho’ all y’all kids don’t grow! /

    I don’t think there’s any other reading than the persona announcing their intent to use a “.44” on all the parties listed, which is a death threat for sure. Additionally, IANAL, but according to Greg Hill and Associates,

    Death threats in a rap song can constitute criminal threats or threats against a crime victim (Penal Code § 140(a)) even if the victim never hears the song.

    So yeah, I think this could still “reasonably be taken as [a threat] today”.

    • bitofhope@awful.systemsEnglish
      9·
      10 months ago

      And this is why whenever I send non-threats to people I oppose politically, I prefer black metal or WP skinhead lyrics.

      • Soyweiser@awful.systemsEnglish
        9·
        10 months ago

        Silmänkantamattomiin jää silmät sokaisee Viima täynnä vimmaa viiltää läpi käsien Vuoret ympäröivät saalistaan, niin vailla uskoa Mistä voimme täällä elää? Mistä löydämme tien eteenpäin?

        Ha! That put you in your place.

        • bitofhope@awful.systemsEnglish
          12·
          10 months ago

          I’d feel pretty threatened if someone suddenly began messaging me in Finnish if not for the fact that I am Finnish myself.

          • Soyweiser@awful.systemsEnglish
            9·
            10 months ago

            Wait that is Finnish? ;)

            I just copy pasted a piece of metal text which I knew I couldn’t understand when I heard it. (Did check if first if it doesn’t shout something vile however) Was worried somebody would go ‘that isn’t black metal that is pagan metal!’ and I would lose my metal card.

            • bitofhope@awful.systemsEnglish
              11·
              10 months ago

              Being worried that someone calls you out for misidentifying a metal subgenre is a metal fan staple. In any case Moonsorrow is definitely at least BM adjacent and a lot of black metal musicians are pagan for… varyingly good reasons.

              Did check if first if it doesn’t shout something vile however

              Hmm dunno, “The ice blinds your eyes as far as the eye can see, the wind furiously slashes through hands, the mountains surround their prey…” Sounds pretty violent 😉