- cross-posted to:
- palestine@lemmygrad.ml
- cross-posted to:
- palestine@lemmygrad.ml
Note:
I swapped the original article at the request of a mod to from a source deemed more reliable, but to avoid confusion when reading the comment section prior to this edit, here is the link to the original article. I chose the Relief Web source listed by some who commented. Cheers!
Hamas is shit for putting terror and attacking Israel above taking care of their own civilians. Israel is shit for mass-execution of innocent civilians.
They’re both shit, but we all know this will only end with Israel exterminating an entire population, which is even shittier.
The reason Hamas is in existence is because their peoples’ homes being taken and the Palestinians being killed constantly, for years. What would you do if your nation has lived in their land for ages, and a people came and took your family homeland and killed your family, and took neighborhoods and whole swaths of areas, then penned you up so that you couldn’t exit or enter your country without their permission…don’t you think you’d rise up with some other warriors to do something, anything? That’s what Hamas is. It is not a terrorist organization to go out and cause terror and trouble. It is the fighting representative of a beaten people.
Did you not notice the events that started this recent shit? Hamas certainly engages in terrorism, as does the IDF.
Removed by mod
Did you not notice the giant wall around Gaza and the starvation and israeli bombing of their infrastructure before October the 7th?
Are you gonna call the Ukrainians terrorists too for blowing up the train track that connects Russia to China?
Good analogy.
Removed by mod
It’s so goddamn hilarious that because of history and The Holocaust we aren’t allowed to bring up how deliciously ironic it is that a group of people that were rounded up for extermination are summarily rounding up a group of people for extermination.
I can’t wait to see how this plays out in history.
Who’s not allowed to bring it up? I’ll say it all day. I give no fucks that Israel doesn’t like it, fuck them.
Keep in mind the Holocaust was all Jews, and Israel here in no way represents all Jews, as much as they’d like to.
It fits in perfectly with history unfortunately. Members of group A inflict horror on members of group B. Some time passes, and some members of group B choose to inflict horror on group C and/or group A.
It’s all just radical subsets of the population, who would love nothing more than to represent their whole group.
I would just like to point out that the Holocaust was not JUST Jews. Other people were persecuted as well (such as LGBTQ+ peeps)
Disabled people and political dissidents too. But LGBTQ+ people is especially apt to point out in this day and age.
And black people.
The Nazi campaign was mostly focused on Jews because they were the biggest and easiest to target minority but the Nazi’s killed everyone that wasn’t from “their group of people” and tried to replace that population with their own (expanding the Lebensraum)
Pretty much. If you weren’t white and straight and a sycophant, you were on the chopping block. Normally women would probably be too, except they wanted that to have more Aryan babies 🤮
The Roma (aka Gipsies).
Everybody forgets them, strangelly.
I noticed that the holocaust page on Wikipedia conveniently forgets to state the other non-Jewish victims, then I realized that the Holocaust with a capital H only includes Jewish victims according to Wikipedia itself:
I don’t really know what to think of this.
Apparently some don’t like to include LGBTQ, the disabled, and non-Jews under the term “Holocaust” despite shit like this:
If anyone is well versed in genocide studies and history, please enlighten us!
Thanks for remembering.
Isreal is nothing but a continuation of the holocaust. The mass migration of jews from their nation of origin to a colony is genocide from all the European nations and America who supported and funded its creation. It was final solution part 2. Not even an original one, the nazis had the Same idea first for Madagascar
That’s ahistorical and makes no sense. So, the UN created Israel to genocide the Jews?
Don’t agree with the comment you replied to, but I guess they meant “created Israel to get rid of the Jews in Europe”
Correct. Thank you for the positive interpretation. I can offer sources if you like.
It doesn’t hurt to add sources in any case. I know that UN created the state but I doubt anyone documented the reason for doing that especially such one
Removed by mod
Yeah, people should’ve figure out by now that in dimensions of their murdering, the disparity of strength (and hence of responsability in their use) and the moral standards expected from the dictatorial resistance movement of a long occupied land vs those of a supposedly Democratic nation (and Israel has long leveraged their image as Western-style Democracy all the while the place turns out to - surprise surprise - culturally be yet another of the racist theocracies so common in the region), Hamas is to Israel as a flea is to a rabid dog.
Everytime anybody goes “yeah, but Hamas” they’re doing the propaganda game for Israel.
We’re way beyond a proportionate response by this point and into the style of “payback” the Nazis did in France when after being attacked by the Resistance Française they would go to a French village and chose and kill 10 people for each German the Resistance had killed.
But it is a both sides situation. Both sides have the same goal. Externinating the other. One side is just much more powerful.
Yes I’m sure all those dead little girls just wanted to exterminate the Jews.
But the dead Israeli babies DO want to exterminate the Palestinians? What a weird point you’re trying to make.
Yeah you could make the same sarcastic remark that way too
Removed by mod
It’s overall an awful situation, there isn’t any “both sides” because both sides are shit and would happily genocide one-another. One side just happens to have the means to actually carry out that genocide, making them especially more shit.
What’s the morally correct thing to do: Am I supposed to put a Gaza flag on my social medias and gush about how Israel is terrorizing and destroying them and say that I stand by Hamas? I already shit on Israel because of their genocide. However, Hamas would (once again) do the same exact thing if given the chance.
Specifically picking a side is stupid because if Hamas could, they’d do the exact same thing.
It really muddles the reality of what is happening.
Why not? It’s the one fundamental differences when comparing this conflict with the Nazi extermination of jews (and others).
The jews didn’t massacre German civilians before their attempted annihilation.
It’s not much of a difference, in the entire score of things, but both Hamas and the idf have blood on their hands. Neither have done things benificial to the Palestinian people. The October attack was a strategic mistake of the highest order.
At the time support for the Netanyahu regime was falling, people were demonstrating. They had literally nothing to gain. They actually played right into bibi’s hand.
Not that I approve of the Israeli reaction, it’s horrible and indeed a case study on the banality of evil. It is completely outside of all proportions. To say that only one side is to blame, is wrong. Without oct 7 this would never have happened. To deny that you would have to prove that it was a false flag attack.
Removed by mod
I do get the analogy of the Warsaw ghetto, I’ve used the same analogy before.
But the relationship between hamas and the Israeli governement is very curious. If say I’m not on the both sides kind of thing, but on the ‘one of three’. The Palestinian people are suffering under the war mongering of both hamas and the idf. Just like not one hundred procent of Israelis are behind the actions of the idf, most Palestinian people aren’t responsable for the actions of Hamas.
It’s way more complicated than the binary issue you lot try to make it off it and frankly that is tiring and obtuse.
Removed by mod
I’m not disputing that that’s the case. But simplifying a conflict that is almost a hundred years old into a binary blame model is silly.
Removed by mod
For me the problem with the “both sides” argument is that it misses the symmetry issue.
Oh and I would agree that the symmetry is way off. It’s only that the conflict is so old and complex that putting it down to a binary good/bad narrative is quite simplistic.
No one in their right mind would call both sides innocent either. The amount of guilt and the assymetry can be argued about. I tend to agree that the Palestinian people are suffering way more than anyone in that part of the world. It seems that neither hamas nor the IDF care about them at all.
Removed by mod
Removed by mod
And people upvoted like Lemmings
Nah bro Hamas is an organization. From Egypt.
Removed by mod
If Greece sent radicalized people to the USA and created an explicitly radical Greek organization a few decades ago and somewhere inbetween they changed their name, then yes it would be exactly like that.
Removed by mod
That’s like saying any socialist country is necessarily Prussian
The Society of Muslim Brothers who controlled Egypt in the late 60s formed a charity in Gaza Strip in 1973 called Mujama al-Islamiya Islamic who then became known as Hamas in 1987.
You’re an absolute idiot if you think those two organizations are completely unrelated.
No one said they are unrelated.
So you legitimately think every socialist country is essentially directly caused by Prussians? That’s your take?
I would suggest you read it again.
[citation needed]
The Society of the Muslim Brothers first founded in Egypt in 1928 was able to establish in the neighboring nation in 1973 as Mujama al-Islamiya Islamic charity affiliated with the Muslim Brotherhood, which later became Hamas in name in 1987. They also were the most prominent political group in Egypt from 1967 until 2013, when their president over Egypt was overthrown.
Hamas is from Suuni Islamist Egypt, for Suuni Islamist Egypt.
Yeah but that doesn’t support your claim.
My claim is that Hamas’ Origins were outside of Palestine, that Hamas doesn’t give a fuck about Palestinian Genocide. I gave you a concise uncontested timeline of their formation. Maybe you’re just too stupid to get it.
If that was your claim then you phrased it quite poorly. You said they aren’t Palestinian in origin, which is blatantly false. I reocmment you rephrase your original comment so that the rest of us stop misunderstanding you.
Removed by mod
Removed by mod