Grok has been launched as a benefit to Twitter’s (now X’s) expensive X Premium+ subscription tier, where those who are the most devoted to the site, and in turn, usual...
No, choice is universally an illusion. The things I am saying here are also the effect of past events, as is the fact that you responded. The point I’m trying to get across is that moralizing and saying things like “he’s an adult, he should change his behavior on his own” is wishful thinking and neglects a rational approach to what will actually achieve what you want.
Determinism is actually a really silly argument to make for anything. Determinism doesn’t posit that people don’t make choices, but simply that the choices made are determinable, even if they in every way resemble “free choice”. We are a part of the variables that determinism says contributes to these choices, but your solution is we sit with a sock in our mouth because it’s so very mean to tell Elon he’s a cunt “because he has no choice”. You’re, put plainly, a fool, if you believe for a second that predetermined choices make someone any less of an asshole. Elon Musk is a harmful, narcissistic asshole is no different than “the total result of Elon Musk’s predetermined decisions are to behave as a narcissitic asshole.”
Yes, under determinism, he has no choice in the matter, just as a gun used to kill someone has no choice in being a killing machine, or a pencil in a 4th grade classroom has no choice in being a penis drawer.
Deterministic sophistry being used to soften, excuse, or in any way lessen the value of peoples’ individual actions is mere sophistry, and completely misses the point of the philosophical theory.
You’re right, it’s a bit silly to claim that people don’t make choices. I use the word “choice” all the time for something that I believe is happening in me and in others. The AI in a computer game also makes choices, every if/else statement in a piece of software is a choice. It comes down to what people mean with the word. What I disagree with is the notion that there’s something ethereal happening that decides if a person “deserves” to be spit and kicked on - just on account of them being morally reprehensible and not based on any meaningful analysis of what would improve the situation.
but your solution is we sit with a sock in our mouth because it’s so very mean to tell Elon he’s a cunt “because he has no choice”.
That’s misrepresenting what I’m saying. I’m absolutely not saying that we should just let him go on because he has no choice. That would be like letting an alligator roam free in the city because “it’s just doing what alligators do.” But to kick and spit on the alligator “because it’s evil” isn’t a good strategy either.
I’m saying Elon is a problem, and to fix the problem we should analyze what is causing the problem and devise a rational plan of action that will mitigate that as much as possible. At its core it’s a question of mindset - are you just letting your anger out because he’s the devil, or are you keeping a cool head and thinking about how to attack the problem at its root. Ultimately the goal should be to make the future better, not to exact retribution for the past.
The part about not being mean is not because I think he should be excused from his actions. It’s because I think that being mean is counterproductive. It’s pushing him further into the hole where we don’t want him to be.
It’s like debugging a computer program: we don’t yell and curse at the program for having bugs; we try to figure out what is causing the bugs and fix them without being overcome by emotion.
Free will has nothing to do with the ability to be influenced, in fact you might even say the opposite is closer to reality. The more predictable something is, the easier it is to influence it. I’m sure you agree that your computer has no free will, and you can easily get it to do different things just by clicking the mouse.
So what’s the rationale for dunking on an idiot? Do you believe that people shitting on Musk on Twitter will actually cause him to be more woke and compassionate toward others?
Yes we are, just more complicated computers. As for deterrent, I don’t think it’s actually working that way. It just pushes him to dig his feet in more.
No, choice is universally an illusion. The things I am saying here are also the effect of past events, as is the fact that you responded. The point I’m trying to get across is that moralizing and saying things like “he’s an adult, he should change his behavior on his own” is wishful thinking and neglects a rational approach to what will actually achieve what you want.
Determinism is actually a really silly argument to make for anything. Determinism doesn’t posit that people don’t make choices, but simply that the choices made are determinable, even if they in every way resemble “free choice”. We are a part of the variables that determinism says contributes to these choices, but your solution is we sit with a sock in our mouth because it’s so very mean to tell Elon he’s a cunt “because he has no choice”. You’re, put plainly, a fool, if you believe for a second that predetermined choices make someone any less of an asshole. Elon Musk is a harmful, narcissistic asshole is no different than “the total result of Elon Musk’s predetermined decisions are to behave as a narcissitic asshole.”
Yes, under determinism, he has no choice in the matter, just as a gun used to kill someone has no choice in being a killing machine, or a pencil in a 4th grade classroom has no choice in being a penis drawer.
Deterministic sophistry being used to soften, excuse, or in any way lessen the value of peoples’ individual actions is mere sophistry, and completely misses the point of the philosophical theory.
You’re right, it’s a bit silly to claim that people don’t make choices. I use the word “choice” all the time for something that I believe is happening in me and in others. The AI in a computer game also makes choices, every if/else statement in a piece of software is a choice. It comes down to what people mean with the word. What I disagree with is the notion that there’s something ethereal happening that decides if a person “deserves” to be spit and kicked on - just on account of them being morally reprehensible and not based on any meaningful analysis of what would improve the situation.
That’s misrepresenting what I’m saying. I’m absolutely not saying that we should just let him go on because he has no choice. That would be like letting an alligator roam free in the city because “it’s just doing what alligators do.” But to kick and spit on the alligator “because it’s evil” isn’t a good strategy either.
I’m saying Elon is a problem, and to fix the problem we should analyze what is causing the problem and devise a rational plan of action that will mitigate that as much as possible. At its core it’s a question of mindset - are you just letting your anger out because he’s the devil, or are you keeping a cool head and thinking about how to attack the problem at its root. Ultimately the goal should be to make the future better, not to exact retribution for the past.
The part about not being mean is not because I think he should be excused from his actions. It’s because I think that being mean is counterproductive. It’s pushing him further into the hole where we don’t want him to be.
It’s like debugging a computer program: we don’t yell and curse at the program for having bugs; we try to figure out what is causing the bugs and fix them without being overcome by emotion.
It’s incredibly rational to dunk on an idiot with a superiority complex.
Why do you think getting a point across matters? When getting a point across to Elon Musk it isn’t worth it since he’s got no free will.
Free will has nothing to do with the ability to be influenced, in fact you might even say the opposite is closer to reality. The more predictable something is, the easier it is to influence it. I’m sure you agree that your computer has no free will, and you can easily get it to do different things just by clicking the mouse.
So what’s the rationale for dunking on an idiot? Do you believe that people shitting on Musk on Twitter will actually cause him to be more woke and compassionate toward others?
Stupid comparison, we are not computers.
So first and foremost, it’s funny.
Second, it’s a deterrent.
Yes we are, just more complicated computers. As for deterrent, I don’t think it’s actually working that way. It just pushes him to dig his feet in more.