For a long time, I thought of the blockchain as almost synonymous with cryptocurrencies, so as I saw stuff like “Odyssey” and “lbry” appearing and being “based on the blockchain”, my first thought was that it was another crypto scam. Then, I just got reminded of it and started looking more into it, and it just seemed like regular torrenting. For example, what’s the big innovation separating Odyssey from Peertube, which is also decentralized and also uses P2P? And what part of it does the blockchain really play, that couldn’t be done with regular P2P? More generally, and looking at the futur, does the blockchain offer new possibilities that the fediverse or pre-existing protocols don’t have?
This is true, the fundamental of a blockchain is simply signed blocks of binary data. We can get into the debates on weather this can work in a public system like many groups are trying now, though I presume that that is not really what the poster is talking about since most public chains fundamentally rely on thier cryptocurrencies to to function, which for some is an argument as to why they can’t work.
My cryptographically signed .pdf for my mortgage document requires no cryptocoin or “blockchain” to function.
Its just simple hashing and signatures. You know, standard cryptography. The thing that allows “HTTPS” connections? The thing that signs your credit-card each time you enter it into Amazon? The thing that signs your password as you type it into the password field?
Yeah, that’s cryptography. Not “cryptocoins” or “blockchain”, its just a cryptographic hash, signature, or encryption.
if you just keep your document on your machine and only use it for personal encryption sure. its a key exchange network, this is for when bob and alice want to talk, not look at something in the safe and put it back. distributed PKI has been a challenge for decades, im not sure about this current incarnation of public systems but I find a lot of promise in many other applications.
I’m not sure if you fully understand what I’m talking about.
https://www.docusign.com/solutions/industries/mortgage
I’m talking about real world business. I’m not getting a $300,000 mortgage leaving a pdf on my personal computer. I’m talking about real world applications here.
Yeahhhh… no. Its point-and-click these days. Most people don’t even realize they’re utilizing PKI to handle typical business transactions. It literally “just works”, click click boom. It happened, and is legally binding, happens hundreds-of-thousands of times a day across this country and is perfectly functioning cryptography.
so if you are looking at this its a question to trust scopes, at least in public systems. here you are trusting:
the proposal for a decentralized ledger with neutral execution is that the only “trust” needed is that in the contracts function, however this is not entirely true, in reality you are shifting trust to:
some people feel this is a better way of doing things, ive found it interesting to work in the space technically but I dont necessarily agree with the wildwest nature of the public systems and am more an advocate of regulated channels if these are going to be done at all. There is also the idea that a large enough network makes it possible for the network to handle larger loads than any individual processor could handle, this has borne out in some cases though its not perfect since we know P2P network instability tends to ripple through a network.
Finally if an application has been built with web3 practices enshrined its entirely possible to ensure service continuity even in the event of the provider failing financially and being unable to serve the users. Important to note this is RARELY done properly and I have only seen a couple cases where it worked so far.
If we are talking the internal org, like docusign itself, an org like might adopt a ledger based system for the in-built capabilities of some chains, you find quickly that enterprise grade cryptographic tracking of large scales of assets or process gets VERY expensive. Ledgers can be very helpful in these cases though are more a consideration when validating a new system rather than it being an impetus to upgrade in and of itself.
I often refer to it as a specialized app-server stack to clients.
And… where does FTX and Celsius come into the mix? Because in practice, that’s where people lose $8 Billion overnight.
Cryptocoin folk pretend they got this “trust” issue figured out, when in actuality, they just technobabble fake words and pretend that I haven’t taken a cryptography class in college. Guess what? I know what a hash is, I know how PKI works and I can implement BTC or Monero.
Just because Cryptocoin community is ignorant of very trivial hacks (ex: a hardware wallet using a shitty RNG which would leak the private-key), and is ignorant of how they are unable to trust even the most basic of operations in their house of cards doesn’t mean anything. (Are you sure that your hardware wallet generates real, random numbers? And not a pre-made list of ~1-billion, easily hacked wallets?)
Cryptocoin fans can’t even solve the hardware wallet trust problem, let alone any other trust issue going on in their little world.
That’s a different conversation isn’t it? shifting from technical capabilities to what people do with them, we have a number of technologies in society that deal with this issue. Important to note that every form of messaging and storage tech ever conceived has likely or is capable of facilitating large scale fraud.
I understand wanting to point the anger, as someone who sat this tech out until I saw the govt take it seriously, I’d say collectively every government and municipality slept on this, which surprises me, I expected this to get killed long before it capped at 2T in value.
Also important to note that cryptocurrency technology was not central to the failure of these orgs as the vast majority of thier holdings never left the exchange. They bascially setup shop claiming to have the tulips everyone was raging for in full warehouses when they didn’t even have seeds. I’m angry at the abject greed as well, however if we apply the current thinking im seeing toward crypto tech as it would logically extend, get ready to throw out all the tech in your house, a surprising amount of it can be used to manipulate and defraud you. Most of FTX’s messaging went out over traditional communication channels, controlled by our governments and endorsed by broadcasters.
You’re saying a lot of words and not addressing the hardware cryptocoin wallet problem I outlined above.
Lets focus on that. How do you know that a hardware cryptocoin wallet truly emits random numbers that aren’t being hacked? The trust problem in this cryptocoin world is horribly, horribly unsolved despite 15+ years.
That’s why these scams keep coming up. Because the “oh just trust the cryptocoin” approach doesn’t work. You need to think from the perspective of a security researcher.
you are talking to someone whos been doing cryptography since the 90s, the answer hasn’t changed since then, you cant. the ONLY was you can be sure is with old school means or controlling your own lithography system.
most people just pick what level of trust/control/effort they are most comfortable with and go with that. the more your life ends up under these keys the more youll want to move to physical storage, multiple cold wallets, etc etc.
This usability nightmare is part of whats hurt crypto’s adoption imo.
Why are insecure devices allowed to be sold? I don’t know, why do we let comcast sell routers with known firmware vulnerabilities that gets a large chunk of them infected with malware? Why do we only deal with dangerous things after they become dangerous and hurt people, esp when the danger is so damn obvious? I don’t know.
Is there a hardware wallet I like that I believe is secure? No
Do i use them? Well of course, insurance companies love them…sigh.
Do I use them for my personal stuff? No, the vast majority of my holdings are stored in physical cold wallets.