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Orville was amazing, everything I remember trek being from my childhood. Weirdly I rewatch that childhood trek now and it isn’t what I remember… But Orville does it right.
Seth hates Disney, so doubt a 4 will ever happen. What I do hope will happen is he comes up with another Orville like show on another platform.
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It may seem like it, but August 2022 wasn’t three years ago.
Even if it was that doesn’t really seem so disqualifying after we’ve just had a new season of Futurama and anticipate a new season of King of the Hill.
Orville may not have the financial draw, but I bet Seth had more fun with that than any of the animated stuff.
Thanks, I deleted my comment
I am decidedly not a Trekkie.
I love every single one of the movies since 2009 (there is one I take issue with, bit it’s relatively minor) and every single one of the new shows. I’ve never seen any of the old shows and they hold absolutely no interest for me.
Having said that, I love Discovery. It is an absolutely fantastic show.
Strange New worlds is among one of the best sci-fi shows I’ve ever watched. It is absolutely fantastic and Anson Mount is utterly fantastic.
For me, the Orville is a window into old Star Trek. I absolutely love The Orville. The way that it touches on difficult subjects is done so beautifully that I can’t even begin to gush about how perfect it is. The moclan arc with topa and the follow-ups were so wonderfully done. As a cis white guy, I can’t think of a better way to handle and portray these situations and how important they are than the way the Orville did.
It is my personal opinion that the biggest enemies of Star Trek are it’s hardcore fans. You guys shit on everything that isn’t old Star Trek and you make it so that new viewers are less likely to check out the shows. You like to crap all over Discovery without understanding that is actually a really good show. It’s also a really good way to bring people like myself that could give a shit less about Star Trek into the universe so that I’m more likely to check out other shows like strange New worlds for example which is about the best representation of what Star Trek is that we’re ever going to get.
That said I do have one major gripe. Beasty boys? JJ Lim, are you fucking stupid? The movie was great up until that point, and then you chose the dumbest way to close it out. How the fuck did this get out of table reading? What the actual absolute fuck?
I blame Discovery and Picard. I tried watching Discovery the other day. I desperately tried, you guys. I quit - and I won’t be watching Picard. I reject the callous and hamfisted writing, so I’ve personally rejected it as cannon at this point.
Star Trek Shorts was kind of okay, and Brave New World was definitely a step in the right direction. I’ll watch that soon because I’m rewatching most of the shows in chronological order (based on this IMDB list). Also, Prodigy is actually pretty great. I’m glad it didn’t get cancelled. It’s a kids show, but the Prodigy writers show they actually care.
But my god. The writers for Discovery and Picard really screwed the pooch. I won’t even blame direction or acting, like at all. What I blame is the paint by numbers forced progressivism, which pisses me off, because it shouldn’t feel forced. It’s Star Trek FFS. It used to be the platform for progressive subjects.
Star Trek has been a playground for masters of the powerplay, for subtext, allusion and theme. It was a progressive platform already, but did so through writing methods which has been employed by writers for thousands of years to convey stories and characters, tried and true methods that yield good quality story telling. All of that went out the window with Discovery and Picard. The writing in those shows is the storytelling equivalent of smashing the square through the circle shape.
When it comes to the Orville? It shows that McFarlane really has a love for Star Trek and that he could have helped to modernize it, in a much better way than what the production team did with Discovery and Picard. But much like with the Flintstone’s reboot, he got shafted. But at least he got bawled out by Tucker in Enterprise while playing the role of an enson. So he’s apart of cannon in some way?
Can you elaborate on what “forced” means?
“Contrived” is a better word I guess. I don’t feel like many of the arcs have been fleshed out, leading to conclusions that are ill deserved Burnham as a character arc is a perfect example of this. I think she gets everything served to her on a silver platter, that the action setpieces are not enough to justify the order of things. This might be an issue with cutting for time, but still.
Ok but why is being served everything on a silver platter “contrived progressivism”? You mean because the actress is black?
What does Burnham get served to her?
I loved season 1 and 2, i just hope 4 will be better than 3
Ah, glad it wasn’t just me who thought 1 & 2 were better than 3. 😅
You are not alone!
Really? Season three is where I really thought Seth toned down the dick and fart jokes and started focusing on what made ST amazing. The whole left behind story where Gordon is trapped for long enough in the past that he has a whole family he has to leave behind was heartbreaking and exactly the sort of storyline that made me love TNG in the first place.
At least Picard learned to play the flute.
I always forget The Orville exists and that I’ve been meaning to watch it, so I’ll go and watch an episode and enjoy it, but the handful of episodes I’ve seen are just enjoyable fluff. They don’t stick with me at all, and I feel no compulsion to keep watching. When does it get compelling?
The first few episodes were indeed rough, but by the end of season 1 it becomes the star trek youve been craving.
It doesn’t. The episodes just get longer and more boring as the show progresses. The cancellation isn’t exactly a mystery.
I know I might be about to ruffle some feathers, but The Orville is how you do representation right imo. The whole story arc with Topa was beautiful.
Like, something that turned me off of nu-trek was how the representation was handled. It felt pandery to an almost gross extent. Like, Jesus Christ man, it’s the year 24-something-something, why are you still acting like being gay is a big deal? OoOoOoOoo oh nooooo, there’s gay people WoooOoOooo. And while I don’t remember there being spoken pandering in the few episodes I watched, there was something about how the scenes were constructed, the shots were lined up, etc, that felt like they were trying to draw attention to the LGBT members doing LGBT things. Again, it’s 24XX, I’m supposed to believe humanity has achieved near-utopia, why am I getting the feeling that you’re trying to show me how gay these dudes are purely because they’re gay. You don’t need to do that. It’s 24XX, who the hell is still getting bent out of shape about homosexuality 400 years from now?
The Orville, on the other hand, just kinda… treated it like it was normal. Some characters are gay, some characters are straight, but the show didn’t really focus on it; some guys just liked other guys more than gals and vice versa. They treated it like it was normal.
Okay, okay, but I brought up Topa, and Topa’s story arc is literally all about Topa’s gender problems. How does that not go against my previous complaints? Well, Topa isn’t human. Topa is from a male-dominated culture that believes femininity is weakness and should be eradicated via gender reassignment. It’s not a human culture, and so it doesn’t clash with the idea of humanity having a near-utopia. A human utopia involves everyone being treated equally, so when you imply different treatment, whether through dialog choices or cinematography, it clashes with that idea. But the Moclans don’t have a utopia, and so putting emphasis on Topa being female makes sense, especially when it comes to the human crew struggling with the clashing ideas of Moclan forced gender reassignment and the human take on sapient rights. Unlike nu-trek, there’s no dissonance there.
It’s 24XX, who the hell is still getting bent out of shape about homosexuality 400 years from now?
I’m pretty lukewarm on Discovery, I’ve seen all of it but most episodes only once, so maybe I just don’t remember it. Who got bent out of shape over Stamets and/or Culber being gay?
There was a multi episode story arc about a teenager (forgot her name, had a teenage boyfriend and got adopted by Stamets/Cullen) coming out as non binary and choosing they as their pronoun.
It was very heavy handed on drama, whereas if there was any internal consistency, there wouldn’t be any “coming out” at all because “staying in the closet” wouldn’t be a thing. The whole thing felt like having a Jane Austen dialogue in present Norway.
I would love to be able to say this was a one off occurrence, but pretty much all dialogue is heavy handed, with excessive drama not supported by the fiction. While TNG is rather under acted, DSC is heavily over acted. Out goes technobabble, in comes soap opera.
A “multi episode story arc”? You mean these 90 seconds? The only way this bit of character and relationship development could be less “heavy handed” would be if it didn’t happen at all.
Don’t be like that. We’re all discussing in good faith here.
Before that happens, Adira spends considerable time with the ghost boyfriend on how would that be received and goes through considerable angst processing it. Before even that it’s shown them in considerable anguish to come out to their boyfriend even.
Of that arc, the one thing well executed was the 90 seconds you pointed.
So yeah, most of it shouldn’t happen in a welcoming environment in the 25th century. Her adoptive parents had no issue being a gay couple adopting a teenager, in which universe would that teenager ever feel the need to hide their sexuality and insecurities from them? Why the anguish?
It’s pretty much established since TNG and DS9 that pansexuality is mainstream. In The Outcast, Riker was involved with a non binary alien; the episode wasn’t about the reactions (the crew was absolutely nonchalant about it), with Worf supporting Riker trying to rescue the alien that broke their social customs. You can still send a message with a good in universe justification.
There’s no in universe justification for Adira. She doesn’t come from a backwards culture, has crazy conservative parents, there’s no atavic crewmate around, no aliens taking offense… It’s a non conflict. It’s bad writing.
To be clear, it’s a message that needs to be on TV. But it’s a damn shame they did it so poorly when it could easily have been set up to actually create a conflict that would then be resolved. You need in universe bigots to show bigotry being overcomed.
There’s no in universe justification for Adira. She doesn’t come from a backwards culture
Regardless of your opinions about the storyline, you can address the character by their proper pronouns. Or you can choose to no longer post here.
It wasn’t intentional. English isn’t my first language and Adira being a female name where I’m from it just slipped out. I did get it right most of the time, but between articulating my thoughts and writing in English, I stumbled here and there.
Or you can choose to no longer post here.
What is that?
What is what?
