@brombek
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105M

Heh, same pattern as ever: corporation takes over, first thing they do is push ads and deploy surveillance. Looks like FOSS projects are vulnerable for their “trademark” (everything other than code and community) takeover. Sounds similar to what have happened to Audacity and OpenOffice before.

There needs to be a better way to protect projects from this form of aggression.

poVoq
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45M

Ultimatly the problem was that a single corruptable individual held the rights to the name and other vital stuff. For a project of the size and importance like Freenode this is highly irregular.

@ConspicuouslyBland
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It’s called cryptoidiocy here in the thread (after your comment) but the better way is actually the crypto concept of DAO: Decentralised Autonomous Organisation.

It’s a bit weird to see crypto, of which one of the fundamentals is being decentralised, being called idiocy on a forum which wants to be decentralised…

@ArtilectZed
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Even Vice has an article about what’s going on. I was not aware that Lee is the Crown Prince of Korea. Or that he is behind shells.com, along with Mark Karpeles. I had been thinking about setting up an account there, but not so sure, now.

https://www.vice.com/en/article/m7ev8y/freenode-open-source-korea-crown-prince-takeover

poVoq
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Yeah and dodgy stuff like PIA and Mt.Gox. I would be much less worried about this if it was someone else.

@j0ta
creator
banned
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65M
@ajz
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65M
@seedmarx
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Why libera.chat over Matrix? This seems like a great opportunity to switch.

@ArtilectZed
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IRC diehards will never switch. I salute them, as a former party member.

@Seirdy
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25M

IRC diehard checking in. I prefer IRC to Matrix (been using both daily for a year or two now), but a switch wouldn’t be the end of the world.

Matrix has a high and growing complexity that makes developing a new client/server hard; as the spec grows, devs need to keep updating servers/clients with new features or risk being left behind. IRC clients can be whipped up by an individual in a short amount of time and then enter “maintenance mode”.

System requirements for running a Matrix server are extremely high with Synapse, and not that great with Dendrite and Conduit compared to most IRC implementations because of the need to sync room histories.

Matrix also has a lot of features that I’ve come to find unnecessary/distracting: typing notifications, stickers, profile pics, etc. It’s possible to carve out a subset of the protocol and just use that, but at that point it’s probably better to just use IRC.

poVoq
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5M

So switch from one mostly centralized service being currently taken over by a dodgy crypto-currency linked company (Freenode Inc.) to one that already has been a for-profit dodgy crypto-currency funded company (NewVector/Element) for some years?

Libera.chat is at least run by a Swedish non-profit with all volunteer admins (but is also too centralized).

@freezingwinter
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45M

I don’t see any reason for communities which prefer IRC to make a move to matrix but your comment seems unfounded.

Matrix Foundation, which is a steward of matrix protocol, is a UK non-profit community interest company.

Element is a for-profit but how exactly is it dodgy? It is primarily a FOSS company. Their only connection to cryptoidiocy I know of is in some experimental P2P matrix implementations.

poVoq
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5M

Read up a bit on the funding history of New Vector Ltd. i.e. about their VC funding and the “strategic” 2018 merger with Status (Ethereum-based chat and crypto wallet app).

The foundation was IMHO only created as an afterthought to make [Matrix] more palatable for the wider OS community.

@freezingwinter
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35M

From the blog by status:

Furthermore, the collaboration between Status and Matrix is expected to:

  • Utilize the Status Network token within Riot.im by enabling crypto assets
  • Create a bridge between Matrix and Whisper (Ethereum’s own real-time communication protocol)
  • Integrate Status DApps as widgets within Riot.im

This does sour my view of Element.

Matrix Foundation might have been an afterthought but it still is a valid step in ensuring at least some independence of the protocol from Element.

poVoq
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15M

True, the foundation is not all bad, but at least currently the people in charge of it are the same persons (& close friends) as those running NewVector Ltd. Once that changes significantly I am willing to soften my stance on the foundation itself.

@ajz
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deleted by creator

craigevil
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45M

##linux and #slack among others have already created channels on Libera

poVoq
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35M

While it might be a quick fix to just move over, I am hoping that people take this opportunity to reduce IRCs centralisation on a few providers and push some more modern standards compliant IRCds like Oragono. Libera.chat sadly uses a IRCd that has very few modern additions.

A place to discuss privacy and freedom in the digital world.

Privacy has become a very important issue in modern society, with companies and governments constantly abusing their power, more and more people are waking up to the importance of digital privacy.

In this community everyone is welcome to post links and discuss topics related to privacy.

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