@dragonX
122M

To add to what has been mentioned. the web is also dying.
Apps have replaced navigators. social media replaced personal blogs. SEO optimized article-farms and copycat sites replaced genuine information and help website. + 90% of webpages don’t get traffic from google according to aherf : https://ahrefs.com/blog/search-traffic-study/

Ephera
62M

Also, we’re essentially back to a browser monopoly.

poVoq
12M

As bad as that is in general, IE was mainly a problem because it lagged behind and wasn’t standard conformant, while Chrome drives the standards and is rather a problem because it implements too much new stuff all the time.

Strong disagree. IE was bad because it was heavily tied to the interests of its controlling entity. Things like ActiveX broke the OS-agnostic principles of the web. As it was the bundled default browser used by the majority, and therefore the main target of webdevs, its quirky behaviour became a way to enforce its use and help make non-Windows users second-class web citizens.

Now Chrome is well established in its number one spot, we’re seeing more initiatives from Google to use that dominance to similarly create dependencies for users on the Google ecosystem.

Ephera
12M

Yeah, but IE didn’t either start out its life as a shitty browser. It was the stagnation after they reached the monopoly that got it there.

I don’t think, Chrome’s path will go exactly the same, as for example Google has an actual financial interest in the internet at least being somewhat healthy/growing. But at the same time, there’s also aspects that might make the journey worse this time around:

  • Google has significant web properties that average users will want to continue using, even if e.g. Google starts using proprietary APIs on there.
  • Google is a lot slier than Microsoft in this regard. For example, Android was open at first, but over years it grew this proprietary abscess (Play Services), which they forced onto vendors behind the scenes and stuff like that.
poVoq
12M

Hmm maybe my memory is hazy, but I remember IE as always being pretty shitty (but yes even more so in later days), with it’s only “quality” being that it came build in with Windows.

Dessalines
admin
102M

Agree with this. The web is much worse than it was 15 years ago. Over time things should be getting less bloated, not more. I had an awful desktop PC, but I could still do instant messaging, web browsing, and listen to music. Now a comparable machine would maybe be able to run 1 electron app.

kazutrash
52M

Total agreement to you, since my switch to Debian all my work and production increased pretty much, being able to edit images, videos and doing daily work never has been so fruitful as now . Everytime i’m hearing someone say that it’s desktop or laptop is a crap, i think exactly the opposite.

poVoq
12M

Maybe use XMPP instead of bloated Matrix? :p

Dessalines
admin
22M

Matrix has a lot a front ends that aren’t in electron, I currently use nheko, but I think there are a few others.

@levity
12M

If you can get your contax to use xmpp my hat is off to you… i have tried and failed

@yogthos
7
edit-2
2M

Pretty much all the problems described in the article are artifacts of capitalist model driving web development. Websites are constantly looking for ways to monetize their users, to create lock-ins, and so on. And, as always, capitalism leads to consolidation and monopolies, so we now have a handful of websites most people visit.

Good news is that we’re now seeing a new model with Fediverse that’s largely run non-profit by volunteers and activists. I think this is facilitated by VPS hosting prices having come down significantly and containerization technology like Docker making deployment and maintenance easier.

I see Fediverse as the future of open web that’s bringing back all the nice things that have been stomped out by the commercial web.

poVoq
22M

Sounds like grumpy old get off my lawn rambling (takes one to know one).

Sure desktop browsing didn’t change much and in some ways got worse, but the web was basically rebuild from ground up to support mobile devices in the same timeframe. Back in 2005 surfing the web on a handset was really painful, even on the great N900 communicator type devices.

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