trash
91
trash
Dessalines
admin
link
331M

Mandatory post of my Why not Signal? I wrote a few months ago.

Baobab
link
9
edit-2
1M

Thanks for sharing, it was a good read.

@Blinky
link
-2
edit-2
25d

deleted by creator

@TheAnonymouseJoker
mod
link
11M

Let me guess… NoGoolag or SpiteChat?

Iván Ávalos 🇲🇽
link
-9
edit-2
1M

I’d say the article is a combination between conspiracy bullshit and reasonable skepticism. It’s also defending CCP’s crimes against humanity on the basis that the CCP “prefers autonomy.” I wish freedom and human rights to all Chinese people.

@m532
link
41M

Don’t fall for the smear campaign. Remember when Big Tech launched a smear campaign against Richard Stallman when he came back to the FSF? This is pretty much the same, but done by Big Media.

Also, who wishes “freedom” and “human rights” to people? That usually means death and slavery (see Libya). Do not wish that to people.

Iván Ávalos 🇲🇽
link
-3
edit-2
1M

The campaign against RMS and the FSF was stupid and those who wrote the letter (and many of those who signed it) are full of shit themselves.

The “smear campaign” against CCP is something totally different. We’re talking about a whole government that exercises opression, tortures Uyghurs and forces propaganda on everyone. There’s plenty of evidence about most of their actions, most of which are even official and publicly recognized by the government itself.

Now, the whole “freedom is slavery” sounds exactly like 1984’s Ingsoc slogans. It’s not worth discussing this with you, you need help.

@m532
link
21M

It is absolutely not something “totally different”. They are both enemies of big corporations and want to free the people from the control of the corporations. The smear campaigns have many things in common, like taking events that happened a long time ago, assuming malicious intent, framing something in a deceptive way, accusing without evidence…

Iván Ávalos 🇲🇽
link
-2
edit-2
1M

Ha, ha, “we want to free people from corporations,” says the government of a pseudo-socialist country where people are subject to government-enforced 24/7 surveillance by huuuuge national corporations that control everyone. People are economically ranked according to their level of brainwashing, those who dare to criticize the government’s actions are sevely punished.

@Yujiri
link
21M

I notice that the people disagreeing with you never actually address your points hmmmm

@bluerabbit
link
-31M

Bold move criticising the CCP on Lemmy. Closed source software = evil, forced labour camps = autonomy

@AgreeableLandscape
admin
link
4
edit-2
1M

[Lemmy claims that] forced labour camps = autonomy

So this pretty strongly indicates that you have never actually read any pro-China arguments and probably only hate them because you’ve been told to. No rational person who supports China thinks that the “Xinjiang genocide” is happening (and there is plenty of hard evidence debunking Western claims that it exists, they’re all over Lemmy so have a look see), and we certainly don’t support any sort of genocide.

Iván Ávalos 🇲🇽
link
-3
edit-2
1M

I can imagine the “evidence”: the Xinjiang genocide is not real because our absolutely transparent, benevolent and honest dictatorship government says so.

No rational person who supports China thinks that the “Xinjiang genocide” is happening.

Why would it be? Is it because all of them are so brainwashed by Chinese propaganda? No, I don’t think so. Hail CCP!

@AgreeableLandscape
admin
link
5
edit-2
1M

I can imagine the “evidence”: the Xinjiang genocide is not real because our absolutely transparent, benevolent and honest dictatorship government says so.

Again, this just shows that you have never actually seen any arguments against the Western narrative. Most of the commonly presented evidence is not from the Chinese government. It’s a mix of independent sources and finding that there are more holes in the Western narrative than Swiss cheese.

This is the supporting evidence I speak of. You’ll find that almost none of it is Chinese in origin:

https://github.com/dessalines/essays/blob/da19302634394d2cb77bc86f19997b2173d5531f/socialism_faq.md#on-mao-maoism-and-marxism-leninism-maoism-and-the-prc

https://lemmy.ml/post/47231

https://lemmy.ml/post/70239 – Poking holes in a Pulitzer prize winning article about China’s supposed concentration camp

https://lemmy.ml/post/79162

https://lemmy.ml/post/74653 – This one’s from the Italian government.

Why would it be? Is it because all of them are so brainwashed by Chinese propaganda?

You say that while not reading beyond what your absolutely transparent, benevolent and honest Western government and mainstream media tells you. The vast majority of English speaking China supporters are that way because they have researched both sides.

I’ll put on their tinfoil hat for a moment… Lemmy development and developers might as well be funded by the CCP to spread propaganda in a weird and intentionally confusing doublespeak campaign!!! They want to spread the message that human rights are something of the past, autonomy is best! Hail CCP!

@TheAnonymouseJoker
mod
link
61M

Recommend bringing in some actual verifiable proof. You know, that concept you Western human rights grifters seem oblivious to.

Yes I am an Indian. Yes you have met me on Barinsta Telegram group.

Where’s your verifiable proof then?

@AgreeableLandscape
admin
link
5
edit-2
1M

Yeah, that’s not how it works. You made a claim [that Lemmy’s developers (I assume you also mean admins like me) are funded by the CCP]. Now it is your responsibility to provide evidence before anyone need take it seriously. You don’t get to make a claim and have everyone believe it’s true until someone disproves you.

@AgreeableLandscape
admin
link
1
edit-2
1M

deleted by creator

@nutomic
admin
link
241M

Signal didnt update the source code for the server a whole year, so I would already consider it closed source. Now they are just making it official (but probably still talking about how open they are).

@gmate8
link
-61M

I’m sorry, but you are not correct. They’re updating it.

@nutomic
admin
link
161M

Yes they started updating it again. But for a whole year they didnt. So what i’m saying is that their development is not open at all, and for me thats one of the most important parts of open source.

@KLISHDFSDF
link
-51M

Being developed in secret or rejecting community PR’s does not make a project closed source. They may be your requirements for an open source project, but it doesn’t mean the code is closed source.

You’re conflating two separate ideas and spreading misinformation to dissuade people away from a project you personally don’t like. I find that behavior dishonest and think we can do better than that.

@AgreeableLandscape
admin
link
6
edit-2
1M

Being developed in secret […] does not make a project closed source.

I don’t have a stake in this, but here’s my two cents:

It’s highly unlikely they have not updated their backend code for the whole year that their public repo was silent. By the definition of open source, if they made changes to their production codebase and did not disclose them, it means that said codebase was proprietary for that time.

This is especially true for Signal’s server, since it’s licensed under AGPL-3.0. For ANYONE else using the server code, modifying their production server and not disclosing it for a year is a direct violation of the license’s requirements and in the worst case could get them sued or the right to use the codebase revoked. The only reason that Signal themselves can get away with it is because they own the code so they’re not bound by the license terms, but that means they were explicitly acting outside the bounds of their very own open source project.

@Echedenyan
link
11M

A strawperson, really?

@KLISHDFSDF
link
-101M

Ya’ll really don’t give people a break do you? Make one mistake and you have to live with it forever these days. It’s not like they didn’t release the code or threatened to keep it secret.

Iván Ávalos 🇲🇽
link
16
edit-2
1M

It was not a mistake, afaik. It was intentional. The purpose, I think, was to secretly implement cryptocurrency stuff and release the source code at the same time of the official announcement. That already makes their supposed transparency questionable, but it doesn’t seem like they have changed their mission on keeping Signal free-software to the greatest extent possible. I wouldn’t go as far as to outright call them closed source / proprietary, though.

At least not yet. This whole “spam fighting” excuse not to release parts of the source code is actually pretty common. Others keep the whole source code secret because of it, whereas Signal is at least only keeping the spam-fighting code secret.

@KLISHDFSDF
link
-21M

That’s my though too. It seems people are jumping to conclusions, but what is the real world alternative other than making public the methods being used so that spammers can just look at the code and operate within documented limits? People are against it, but offering zero alternatives, and instead jumping to “Signal bad, boo!”

@gmate8
link
11M

Agreed here.

@newhoa
link
19
edit-2
1M

Purely conspiracy theory here, but this comes just after the reveal that the FBI tried to get user info. Maybe the FBI weren’t happy with the lack of records Signal were keeping and this is a compromise. We have seen this sort of thing before. Gov wants info, an extra closed layer is created. If it’s not this, the timing is unfortunate.

Anyway, the blog post is very vague. In all those paragraphs they don’t even mention how this new implementation works. Just that the way it works now isn’t enough. Maybe the interfaces they mention becoming public will help understand it better, but of course the code is closed and unreleased so we’ll never really know.

@AgreeableLandscape
admin
link
4
edit-2
1M

Holy crap I didn’t even think about this! It’s totally possible and has happened before as you said!

you forgot XMPP as an alternative. For example the snikket project is developing a XMPP ecosystem with clients for every platform.

@jazzfes
link
9