• @vitaminka
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      -11 year ago

      i never understood this rhetoric: like yes, there is like a nazi group in ukraine, they even have their own small political party, which completely failed to capture any legal mandates whatsoever in every election it ever participated in iirc… how is invading a the country and killing ppl gonna help that? if anything, ukrainians will be forced to band together with them, if it means protection for them…

      • @Aria@lemmygrad.ml
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        61 year ago

        The invasion doesn’t help. There are more Nazis in Ukraine than ever. But if Ukraine is demilitarised, the Nazis would then also be demilitarised. The point isn’t really to legitimise the invasion on anti-nazi grounds, it’s just to push back against the western narrative that the Nazis are few and hold no power in Ukraine. There isn’t one Nazi political party, there are several, and Nazis have a lot of power in the Ukrainian military. Russia is only invading because they are scared of NATO on their border, not to help Ukrainians.

      • @PolandIsAStateOfMind
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        01 year ago

        You might not get it, just as nobody in a fucking murica and UK given a shit in the first time. And anyway, the reason for invasion wasn’t it.

        Oh i guess they should just vote the nazis out, like in 2014?

        • @vitaminka
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          1 year ago

          And anyway, the reason for invasion wasn’t it.

          putin mentioned “de-nazification” in his speech announcing the war as one of the key reasons

          You might not get it, just as nobody in a fucking murica and UK given a shit in the first time.

          how does invading ukraine help with their nazi problem?

          • @PolandIsAStateOfMind
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            1 year ago

            putin mentioned “de-nazification” in his speech announcing the war as one of the key reasons

            Nice to see he’s now an unquestionable authority for you. If that was sole reason they would attack in 2014.

            in world war 2 the fight against nazi germany was realistically the only way to defeat nazism, because it was a whole ass hypermilitaristic totalitarian country with an official nazi ideology hell-bent on conquering the world and killing millions of undesirable ethnicities… ukraine doesn’t have these traits

            It does all those, just on a small scale. Also holocaust did not started immediately in 1933, nor it appeared immediately in its full form. If any lesson is to be taken from that, is that the nazism is to be smashed as soon as possible. And Ukraine regime is by their own mouths undeniably nazi, you don’t venerate nazi war criminal without explicit acceptance of his main actions.

            doesn’t mean ukraine doesn’t have a nazi problem, i just struggle to see how invading them is a solution to that in any way

            You think it would be just better to vote them out /s Or maybe do nothing, once they murder all the undesirables surely there would just peacefully coexist with everyone, no?

            FYI my main critique of Putin in the case of Ukraine is that he allowed that shit to happen in the first place. He should support Yanukovych. And then support the Donbass much more. I guess that makes him more democratic than all the west who have no qualms about meddling anywhere they want, hahahaha.

            Huge edits happening in your post as i write this.

            • @vitaminka
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              61 year ago

              Nice to see he’s now an unquestionable authority for you. If that was sole reason they would attack in 2014.

              authority is not relevant here, you don’t have to trust or distrust the person giving them, you just have to listen to what they say to learn the reasons, because they’re literally just saying them, legitimacy and subtext of those reasons is a separate issue

              is that the nazism is to be smashed as soon as possible

              i agree, but has that worked out well so far with this war? if anything, all western countries now sympathize with ukraine, providing them with weapons and all that, and pointing out issues with ukraine is now equated to wanting all ukranians dead or something like that

              Huge edits happening in your post as i write this.

              yeah, sorry, i was trying to rephrase to make my argument more concise

              • @PolandIsAStateOfMind
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                1 year ago

                authority is not relevant here, you don’t have to trust or distrust the person giving them, you just have to listen to what they say to learn the reasons, because they’re literally just saying them, legitimacy and subtext of those reasons is a separate issue

                We shall know them by their fruits, to loosely quote certain popular book, as of now that fruit is very uncertainly ripen or not. And i did not said it wasn’t motive at all, just it was not the prime motive, it just piled up since there are many of them.

                but has that worked out well so far with this war?

                Pretty much yes, wherever Russia have military presence.

                if anything, all western countries now sympathize with ukraine, providing them with weapons and all that, and pointing out issues with ukraine is now equated to wanting all ukranians dead or something like that

                That would happen no matter what. Western media openly whitewashing nazism is pretty clear pointer on what do they really stand for. Note: they aren’t sypathetic to Ukraine, they are antirussian which is very much different things, as you could see from their articles from before the war. Also all the western fash did a 180 from “slavic mongolic subhumans” to which cathegory they did counted Ukrainians before too. Again it all makes clear what is the real core point here - USA hegemony and Russia opposing it.

                yeah, sorry, i was trying to rephrase to make my argument more concise

                No problem, i did quoted what was up at the moment.