Just so we’re all clear on that.

I’m not sure where else to post this, but an announcement and it’s important. Feel free to remove this if it really doesn’t belong.

Sources that masks and social distancing work

@X51
link
15M

I’m fully vaccinated now (more than 2 weeks past the 2nd booster shot). I was wearing the mask and social distancing at work for the past year. Now I only wear the mask if I’m out in public and people don’t know I’m vaccinated or people aren’t socially distancing at work around me.

People can still spread it if vaccinated, but the risk is much lower. About a dozen people tested positive around me at work last year and I made it through the exposure without catching it.

I did the antibody test and the Covid-19 test prior to getting vaccinated. Both were negative which seems like a miracle. The 2nd vaccination shot kicked my @## and I had to stay out of work 3 days.

@marmulak
link
81Y

@seahorse
link
81Y

but muh freedums

@Manmoth
link
2
edit-2
1Y

Not sure if you’re meme-ing but shutting the world down over this is a massive overreaction. Wash your hands, stay in reasonably good health and don’t be reckless. If you are in poor health take the necessary precautions. The way all of this is being handled is setting an terrible precedent that will inevitably be used to strip people of personal liberties in the future.

@seahorse
link
31Y

I disagree

@Manmoth
link
01Y

Go on.

Duel
banned
link
-10
edit-2
1Y

removed by mod

@SloppilyFloss
link
101Y

^ This mentality right here is why the US has had so many cases

@AgreeableLandscape
admin
creator
link
61Y

I’ve removed it so as to reduce the spread of COVID-19 misinformation.

@SloppilyFloss
link
31Y

Keep up the good work admins

@Manmoth
link
21Y

good work admins

I really don’t know when censorship became this new awesome idea that people cheer for on the sidelines.

@SloppilyFloss
link
11Y

The person was spreading rhetoric downplaying the COVID-19 pandemic, in the US of all places. I hardly care if they’re censored for dangerous rhetoric like that, especially on a random forum online.

@Manmoth
link
-31Y

Random forums online used to be where people had conversations freely. Instead even FOSS projects are mimicking failed social networks that editorialize to block out all but a certain viewpoint. I probably agree with that guy. I DO think that this is all over-hyped and we’re stopping the world for something that has a mortality rate similar to a bad flu season. But of course conversations are stopped before they are started just so people can jerk themselves off and feel good for ‘saving somebody from misinformation’. Give me a break. If the Lemmy project has proved anything to me in this thread it’s that the Reddit ‘consensus’ model just promotes mediocre discussion where variants from the norm are blotted out.

@stvn
link
01Y

Is removing it fair though? I feel like downvoting to oblivion is a better way to do it… I wanted to know what this guy said, now I’ll never know haha

@AgreeableLandscape
admin
creator
link
8
edit-2
1Y

You can still see it in the modlog. Most removed content isn’t deleted from the server. COVID-19 is no joke and I want to minimize the chances of people getting the wrong idea and putting themselves and others at risk.

@stvn
link
31Y

Sure… no problem. How do you access the mod log? By the way, the only issue I had was then like if the mods saw an opinion they did not like, then is it right for them to remove it for misinformation? I don’t know the rules for removal. My only rule for removal would be if the commenter was genuinely threatening someone on the site… but that’s just me.

@Manmoth
link
-3
edit-2
1Y

I can’t tell you how disappointing it is to try and use a FOSS alternative to Reddit just to see comments deleted because the mod disagrees. Literally hall monitor tactics. FREE SPEECH isn’t a joke and if it’s truly free it isn’t conditional. Having enough faith in people to develop their own opinions isn’t a joke either. Don’t know what this guy said but it deserves to stand and be judged on it’s own merits or lack thereof.

@Stoned_Ape
link
-21Y

Wow. I have to say… “factually incorrect” is not really fitting here. Not at all. I don’t agree with what the user said, but the user simply gave his personal opinion. There was no statement that could have even been “factually incorrect”, or “misinformation”. I don’t think we should must wear masks is just a personal statement. Nothing to be “factually incorrect” or “misinformation” there.

Also, as a side note: If everybody can see the comment in the modlog, why remove it here? As you can see, people are curious to know what has been said, and they will take a look.

@AgreeableLandscape
admin
creator
link
6
edit-2
1Y

I have to say… “factually incorrect” is not really fitting here. Not at all.

Every medical professional from China to Europe to the US says that COVID-19 is a major threat to life and that its effects have not been exaggerated (many even claim it’s been downplayed in most of the world), and every medical professional says that masks and social distancing are vital to slowing down the pandemic. What qualifications does this person have to say that “Corona, by the information that I know, has been blown out of proportion”?

@Duel@lemmy.ml, are you able to provide any reputable and properly scientific sources that say that COVID-19 is no big deal or that masks and social distancing are not necessary? If you want sources supporting masks and social distancing, here.

@Stoned_Ape
link
-21Y

Every medical professional from China to Europe to the US says that COVID-19 is a major threat to life

Not literally everybody, but I agree that the scientific consensus is that we should be wary and avoid spreading the virus to people who are prone to suffer significant consequences until we know more or have a cure of any sort, so that lives can be saved.

However…

and that its effects have not been exaggerated

That is absolutely not something that any scientist would have ever said. I’m sure that you can see what I mean.

What qualifications does this person have to say that “Corona, by the information that I know, has been blown out of proportion”?

Please take a closer look at the statement. I’m rather sure that I understand what kind of interpretation you had in your mind while reading it, but ultimately, this is not an absolute nor a quantifiable statement. It is a relative statement, and without the context it can’t be “wrong” or “right”. We have to know what the user exactly means with that in order to be able to understand the statement in the way it was made.

In Sweden for example, the government and the citizens think that nobody should be legally obliged to wear a mask. People still do it. Stating that nobody should be forced to wear a mask it not the same as stating that “Corona is all a lie” or something.

Dessalines
mod
admin
link
31Y

Sweden not mandating masks (because freedom is more important than public health) and having the 17th worst response covid response in terms of deaths per population.

@Stoned_Ape
link
-11Y

As I said in a different comment: Thanks for the link! Something very interesting can be seen there. Countries which mandate masks still have higher numbers. It’s almost as if just comparing simple numbers isn’t showing the whole picture of the situation…

Dessalines
mod
admin
link
31Y

Countries which mandate masks still have higher numbers.

This isn’t true at all; the countries with the best covid responses are China, Taiwan, Vietnam, etc which put entire regions on lockdown w/ very strict mask rules.

@k_o_t
admin
link
21Y

the countries with the best covid responses are China, Taiwan, Vietnam, etc

ok, i’m not necessarily saying that these countries don’t have the best responses to coronavirus, they very well might have, we can’t tell with absolute certainty, however, i think you should consider the rather suspicious inverse correlation between the number of coronavirus cases per 1 million people and journalistic freedom index and government corruption index

(this isn’t the case for all countries of course, but it is for many of the “best” responders to coronavirus)

@Stoned_Ape
link
-11Y

This isn’t true at all

Seriously? Why the fuck would you say something like that?

the countries with the best covid responses are China, Taiwan, Vietnam, etc which put entire regions on lockdown w/ very strict mask rules.

That may be so, but that is not what we are talking about here. What you’re saying here doesn’t prove nor disprove my statement above.

What the fuck are you talking about?

@ufrafecy
link
0
edit-2
7M

deleted by creator

@Stoned_Ape
link
11Y

As someone who has been in one of those mentioned asian countries since before the crisis and seen the response first hand while also keeping in touch with my western family I can say the comparison is apples to oranges. 100% the best covid response (including mask usage) and a dozen lessons to learn but the approach needs to evaluated comprehensively.

I absolutely don’t disagree with that.

My beef though isn’t with covid opinions or data interpretations, its with silencing dissent heavy-handedly without warning. Imo, much more dangerous than a teenager spouting garbage.

And with twisting of the words of others on top of it. I agree. This kind of moderation is way more problematic than the problem that it is meant to fight.

@Manmoth
link
21Y

No, it’s not fair.

Duel
banned
link
-3
edit-2
1Y

It was not covid misinformation-? Also, there was no point in deleting it if people can still see it easily. I was just sharing my opinion. The federal and state governments cannot force us to wear masks. If a business wants people who enter their doors to wear a mask, then that is the individual businesses right, not the government. If you want to wear a mask, or the business you are entering wants you to wear a mask, then wear it. This is not misinformation. I will not get into my other opinions about covid, as I am sure you would hate them.

@ufrafecy
link
1
edit-2
7M

deleted by creator

@Stoned_Ape
link
2
edit-2
1Y

Also interesting how you didn’t call on @Duel to back up their claims

Lets assume there were any claims in the comment: If you ask me, removing a comment of other users is a substantially different thing than adding your own comment. Of course should the former be backed up, and the latter can just stand on its own.

Duel
banned
link
-3
edit-2
1Y

1: I never claimed that masks do not work, I said that people should not be forced to wear masks by the government. That is just my opinion.

2: On the subject of social distancing, I also believe that the government cannot enforce it, but individuals and businesses can. If someone asks you to step back, or it is mandated by the business you are entering into (let’s say Walmart), then respect that and do it, even if you do not agree with them.

3: The death rate (at least in the US) for Covid is 2.5% (per 100,000) while the flu is 3.4% (per 100,000) My information may be wrong, and I would be happy if you corrected it, but from what I know of, Covid is statistically less deadly than the flu.

Literally all I am saying is that the government should not enforce a mask mandate/social distancing, but that businesses/individuals should if they want to, and that we have blown Covid out of proportion. Respect my opinions please, and follow your own rules (rule #2).

Sources:

https://coronavirus.jhu.edu/data/mortality

https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/fastats/flu.htm

@Stoned_Ape
link
41Y

I never claimed that masks do not work, I said that people should not be forced to wear masks by the government. That is just my opinion.

That’s what Sweden does. Nobody is forced to wear one in Swede, and nobody is forced to distance himself from others. Of course people are still doing it, and the government is giving out recommendations and updates them according to the current situation.

If the chief epidemiologist of Sweden would comment here, would his comments also be removed because his comments could kill people?

Dessalines
mod
admin
link
11Y

Sweden has no right to speak here lol, their covid response is abysmal (no wonder, since they don’t mandate masks). They’re the 17th worst country in terms of deaths per population, they have 590 deaths per 1M people.

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/#countries

@Stoned_Ape
link
-11Y

Thanks for the link! Something very interesting can be seen there. Countries which mandate masks still have higher numbers. It’s almost as if just comparing simple numbers isn’t showing the whole picture of the situation…

@Manmoth
link
-11Y

lmao exactly. It’s almost like being exposed to a disease and getting over it is a natural way to build resistance.

Duel
banned
link
0
edit-2
1Y

deleted by creator

@onlooker
link
21Y

3: The death rate (at least in the US) for Covid is 2.5% (per 100,000) while the flu is 3.4% (per 100,000) My information may be wrong, and I would be happy if you corrected it, but from what I know of, Covid is statistically less deadly than the flu.

Sorry, but I take issue with this argument. The mortality rate isn’t and never was the problem with COVID-19, the infectiousness is! When’s the last time the whole world was infected with the flu at the same time?

Duel
banned
link
1
edit-2
1Y

According to the CDC:

CDC estimates that influenza was associated with 45 million illnesses

This was in 2018, worldwide. At the time of this being written, corona cases are counted at 47,434,036. Those are very close numbers, and you have to keep in mind that corona has lasted longer than the average flu season, due to it being able to survive cold climates better than the flu, even though the flu has been getting progressively better at surviving during the winter months.

Sources:

https://www.cdc.gov/flu/about/burden-averted/2017-2018.htm https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus

I replied under the wrong comment, don’t mind the comment under yours @Stoned_Ape@lemmy.ml

@Stoned_Ape
link
-1
edit-2
1Y

I never claimed that masks do not work, I said that people should not be forced to wear masks by the government. That is just my opinion.

And now this person, who said this exact thing, is banned for this reason:

Trolling, being pro-trump, telling people not to wear a mask during the pandemic.

What the fuck is going on with you guys here? I really love the software Lemmy for what it is: FOSS. That’s great.

But the people behind it are the absolute worst FOSS devs I’ve ever met, and also one of the worst moderators I’ve ever came accross. This exact behavior was the reason to search for alternatives for Reddit. And now, we have that here as well.

I know, this is their instance, and as another user here said: Their instance, their rules. I understand and agree. But I just wanted to give my opinion.

I think Trump is an absolutely awful person and it is a bad thing that someone like him is the president of any country. But on the other hand, people banning other people for being “Pro-Trump” is equally awful. I mean it. It’s the same shit, just from the opposite side.

The worst thing here is: I don’t even know if it is true that the user is “Pro-Trump”. I know that the “don’t wear masks” bit is not true, very apparently so, so I can only surmise that the other statements are equally thought through and truthful. This is an absolutely shitty job for a moderator.

Holy shit. Seriously. I’m flabbergasted how awful people can be. If you want, you can ban me, because I don’t think I want to be around in this instance anymore. Not if one can’t speak his mind without breaking the rules but still has to fear being banned because of opinions.

@Manmoth
link
2
edit-2
1Y

YUP. If the moderation on this instance is anything like I’ve seen in this comment thread then it’s absolute dog shit. Mod is overly sensitive and is likely consooming to much trauma-based entertainment and M5M product. To think that other people need a white knight mod to be so aggressive with banning/deleting or else they’ll consoom fake news and jump into traffic is simultaneously insulting to the user and incredibly arrogant. Nice work mod! Good luck with your shitty board.

@ufrafecy
link
1
edit-2
7M

deleted by creator

@AgreeableLandscape
admin
creator
link
1
edit-2
1Y

For more “benign” types of misinformation, outright removing it might not be appropriate, but misinformation about a potentially deadly disease can get people hurt or killed if someone decides to head it.

@ufrafecy
link
4
edit-2
7M

deleted by creator

Duel
banned
link
-21Y

Thanks. I am fine with you disagreeing with me, but I do not like the mods deleting my posts because my opinion differs from theirs.

@Stoned_Ape
link
31Y

Interesting that this post still gets downvotes, despite being “removed”.

Lemmy Announcements


Feel free to announce new communities here.

Other than that, this is reserved for admin use only.

  • 0 users online
  • 2 users / day
  • 15 users / week
  • 122 users / month
  • 333 users / 6 months
  • 13K subscribers
  • 632 Posts
  • 3.17K Comments
  • Modlog