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@yogthos
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171Y

This is a very unfortunate news. Firefox is basically the only viable alternative to Chrome at this point, and if Mozilla folds then Google will become the gatekeeper of the internet. I would encourage anybody who’s able to donate to Mozilla and encourage others to do so. The web is just too important to be owned by an ad company.

@jsgohac
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41Y

Very sad indeed, but this (and the roadmap outlined in the article) does not sound like an organization about to fold:

This will strengthen our ability to build and invest in products and services that will give people alternatives to conventional Big Tech.

@yogthos
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41Y

Yeah, they’re still going to have around over 700 people there, so I don’t think there’s any imminent danger of Mozilla folding.

@Echedenyan
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2
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1Y

We still have GNOME Web too see how it goes with the faulty features. (Well, on GNU/Linux only)

And from Firefox, well http://thereisonlyxul.org/ illustrates some point… and everything is multiplatform…

@yogthos
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41Y

It’s true, but keeping party with Chrome really does take a big org. Another possible alternative is that we might see a split with the commercial internet. I honestly don’t think that would be a bad thing at this point.

@jsgohac
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5
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1Y

My highly biased opinion is that they should be laser focused on becoming the webs most secure and private browser. Redeploy the resources that are working on pocket, custom home tabs, questionable vpns, secure send and other non-core browser features into growing their existing low-memory, fast rendering core into something that truly protects privacy and keeps up with vulnerabilities out of the box. I would gladly pay a relatively high amount for that.

@yogthos
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31Y

Privacy focused market is certainly growing nowadays, so making that the focus would make sense. This would also be a clear differentiator from Chrome. Mozilla has already been promoting this aspect as well, so it would be natural to make that the focus. I do think they need to find some clear sustainable monetization strategy around that though.

@jsgohac
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21Y

True, some basic back of the napkin math shows even if 100,000 users initially bought modest licenses, they could’t even fund a small dev team. Maybe falkon or another community project will rise up.

@dreeg_ocedam
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10
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Dessalines
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71Y

It is really sad. We’d be lost without firefox. The browser is the most used application on any system, and being locked to chrome, IE, or safari, which are all deeply connected to the US state, would be a terrible thing.

@koavf
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51Y

And there niche browsers, of course like Lynx, Otter, Pale Moon, etc. but those are not realistic choices for taking on Blink/Chromium-based supremacy. Mozilla in general and Firefox in particular are critical for the health of the Web.

@Echedenyan
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-11Y

Well, Pale Moon is not just a ‘niche browser’: http://thereisonlyxul.org/

@koavf
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61Y

Pale Moon’s market share is part of 0.04% and is developed by a single person who is using a years-old fork of Gecko. That is 100% a “niche” by any rational definition.

@Echedenyan
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1
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1Y

Given that is part of Firefox you can include it in their quota for general use (as user agent use to be set like Firefox for site compatibility in most cases and most trackers identify it as Firefox directly) and avoid the ‘market share’ technicism.

It is also not developed by just a person, that is a big lie: https://github.com/MoonchildProductions/Pale-Moon (and no, only repo and moving there is new, never was developed by just a person, maybe just in the first year but the official forum is filled of other contributions from a lot of time ago)

@koavf
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31Y

What percentage of Web traffic goes to Pale Moon browsers?

Ephera
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21Y

They still backport a lot of patches from Mozilla, though, do they not? So, they would still suffer immensely, if Firefox development stopped or slowed down.

@Echedenyan
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1
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1Y

No, they sometimes take them in account as extra help but that was mostly for Basilisk side in the begining. They are not dependent of that AFAIK.

@dreeg_ocedam
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Travis Skaalgard
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61Y

Webpages are so bloated today. The average webpage today is bigger than Doom.

@koavf
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21Y

Can you give me an e.g. of something unusable? Web mail interfaces (e.g. Gmail) work just fine without scripting and my understanding is that most social media does as well, even if some of the functionality is definitely missing.

Ephera
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41Y

Well, literally this webpage that we’re on right now, for one. PeerTube is another one in the libre space that shows nothing without JavaScript.

There’s a thousand more examples in the non-libre space, but I’d frankly rather not go to those webpages to try this out.

@Echedenyan
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11Y

I think you are confused with the HTML view for GMail. The main interface is directly bloated.

W3Schools main page is also that but in other sense and their code is a mess of CSS with unrecommended things. And like every page you could check of a company built for their own to be exact. Mostly these boostraped-style single webpage with a lot of animations and js involved as well as extra nonsense requests to any Goolag service.

@dreeg_ocedam
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@bluefish009
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41Y

firefox need some solid business model, i think there is some chance link firefox with AI/Machine Learning market. hope they stay well.

@koavf
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21Y

They have recurring revenue with Mozilla VPN and Scroll, so that is something but I of course have no data on how many actual subscribers there are other than me.

@hawkield
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3
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1Y

What is worse is that any of this could have been avoided if they had stuck to doing browser (instead of Pocket, AI, Marketing, Rebranding, Firefox OS, voice recognition, AI stuff)

I cannot express my hate and disgust into words when CEO of a non-profit still gets paid millions of dollars and workers get fired. And when someone asks why is it so, the CEO answers “we have families and bills to pay for”. https://answers.thenextweb.com/s/mitchell-baker-aGY62z

Mozilla should be turned into COOP

@dreeg_ocedam
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@HD_Potato
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10M

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@koavf
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21Y

Donating to the Mozilla Foundation does not directly lead to work by the Mozilla Corporation. I am currently subscribed to Mozilla VPN (monthly), Pocket (annually), and Scroll (monthly): does anyone know of any other ways to support the commercial arm of Mozilla other than creating my own search engine to rival Google and bid up the default search position?

@work_at_google
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2
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1Y

Why do you want to support the commercial arm? Isn’t it the one that got them in trouble?

@koavf
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21Y

Because they need to survive. The commercial arm is what keeps the Firefox browser afloat along with several other development activities—the Foundation does activism, fights for standards, does awareness campaigns, etc. Other than Pocket, Scroll, and the VPN, I don’t think there’s any other way to funnel money into the the Corporation. :/

@work_at_google
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31Y

I see you’re a fan of trickle down economics!

@koavf
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11Y

?

@Wheeljack
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21Y

So what are the likely implications and consequences of this for us? Does this mean that Firefox will receive less updates? That it will become more commercialized? That’s it’s soon dead in the water? No real change?

@dreeg_ocedam
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@koavf
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31Y

Sources claim that they will re-up.

@lemming99
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21Y

Hopefully some of them will return to their roots and contribute to UXP

@gaz
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11Y

It seems to be kinda dead?

@Echedenyan
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2
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1Y

Where?:

Don’t forget to check all the branches, issues and pull requests for these cases in which a person could shit in ‘OH, THEY TOOK LAST COMMIT 8 DAYS AGO ON MAIN BRANCH, THAT IS LOW FREQUENCY’.

Anyways, for MoonChild Productions, main repo is UXP and the other ones are just the specific code for every build.

@VhevSnT2uMSxg
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11Y

degoogle!

@ybaumy
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4
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1Y

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@work_at_google
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21Y

Well http3 already goes away with IPs which would replace the need of VPNS. Unfortunately http3’s adoption is very slow.

@jsgohac
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11Y

I have heard surprizingly little on http3. Do you have any good resources on the IP implications?

Wikipedia has an understandably general description without much detail.

Found this interesting, though it earlier said its not prime time

Stable versions of Firefox and Chrome support HTTP/3 in its current form, but have it disabled by default. Safari 14 will ship with HTTP/3 enabled by default.

@dreeg_ocedam
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@dreeg_ocedam
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A place to discuss the news and latest developments on the open-source browser Firefox

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